If the Feds Won't Do It...

[Egrbvr]

>$1 Bln of cost to Arizona to incarcerate illegals convicted of felonies alone, not counting other costs. Over 1,000 illegals entering each day according to the state. Protests, boycots, lies, political posturing, constitutional questions. What's a border state governor to do?

[charlestudor2005]

Just hope Schwarzenegger never goes to Arizona. With that accent he a lead pipe cinch to be challenged by LE. And jailed if he doesn't have any ID.

[John Bull]

I see that foreign celebs are starting to assemble in Arizona to protest the law. I wonder at the reaction in their countries if Sting, Bono, Jessica Simpson et.al. descended upon them to protest their laws?

[Laurentius]

I am 100% in favor of deporting illegals. (And, so we aren't accused of "breaking up families" letting them bring their anchor babies with them.)

However, I find fault with this approach because, in an era where ANY form of "discrimination" on practically any basis can run you afoul of too many things; it relies on "reasonable suspicion" that the person is illegal.

What is "reasonable suspicion?" Accent? Language? Skin tone? What?

I would prefer replacing that standard with one in which all interactions with any government employee at every level required production of ID. In that case, everyone would be treated equally and we could be assured of the Irish illegals being deported just as certainly as the Mexican illegals.

I do not believe the "reasonable suspicion" aspect of the AZ law will pass muster.

[EmilyHemingway]

I'm of mixed feelings about this one.

On the one hand, I've been over the law and it seems to have been written from a reasonable (as reasonable as can be expected in politics) standpoint. Parts are taken word-for-word from the federal law. Profiling is prohibited. The need for action is demonstrated - the feds should be taking action and aren't, is also fairly well proven.

To the left, my hackles raise at anything that smacks of "Papieren bitte!" and we aren't children, to think that just because officials aren't allowed to profile doesn't mean they won't. A certain portion of everyone in jobs with power is emotionally unfit for the job.

The jury's still out on this one.

[Rudyard K]

Texas is bouncing it around today...and it is a real problem.

On the plus side of reform -

The hispanics (and let's get serious, folks...that's what we are all talking about down here) do weigh heavily on public services.

There are plenty of studies that show that their contribution to public coffers is well short of their cost.

But on the negative side of reform -

Construction, oil an gas, hotel and restaurant staff, etc. is almost exclusively hispanic.

Such manpower does reduce the cost of the services those industries provide to our citizens. Absent that labor?...the cost of everything would be much higher.

It would seem that a guest worker program that is fairly easily accessable to hispanics could be put in place. But labor does not want such a program because of the perception that it takes jobs away from US citizens...and frankly, it does. Those US citizens won't do it at the same cost...absent the hispanics, the jobs would still have to be done, but at a higher cost to us all.

So, we continue to go through this charade of not dealing with it, because some want the hispanic vote, but turning a blind eye to the reality that they are all among us. That way we pay lip service to labor...so their vote is maintained...and to the hispanics...so their vote is maintained.

A guest worker program could solve (to a large extent) the illegal status and labor availability problems. Then the crime issues that attach to a minimal amount of the hispanics could be dealt with more selectively. But woe to the congressman that proposes such a program from labor.

[pjorourke]

I haven't heard this much hyperventilating since a sweet lady tried to coax another O out of me.

Sheesh people, give it a rest. There is nothing in that Arizona bill that isn't required by Federal law. But the Feds aren't doing enough to enforce the deportations and Arizona cops can't enforce Federal law -- they don't have jurisdiction. The new AZ law essentially makes being here illegally a crime under AZ law too so they can enforce.

I'm sure all the local Libs will now proceed to split hairs and pick nits.

[joea08]

What they're doing in AZ is obviously bringing more attention to the situation, but is pointless and will fail. It will fail b/c of the 'civil rights' argument and more celebs coming out against than for, which will sway voters and celebs will throw money at politicians against this law.

A simple start would be to deport the criminals. This would curb some crime and it would be much more difficult for even celebs to argue that people here illegally and commit other crimes deserve to stay.

I recall a few years ago there was a case on the news involving an illegal who had been imprisoned once or twice, let out (never deported), and killed someone. What is being done in AZ is most likely a token gesture to placate frustrated voters.

[pjorourke]

Yeah, I for one always pay strict attention to the opinions of celebrities when I'm voting.

[Rudyard K]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

Yeah, I for one always pay strict attention to the opinions of celebrities when I'm voting.

What if they post nekkid pictures of themselves?.

[joea08]

While we are intelligent enough not to base opinion on what celebs say, recent history shows that there are many ppl in this country who are. Good examples are celebs sleeping with children, murder, ect. Point is there are a lot of ppl who are easily swayed and will defend whatever their favorite celeb says.

[pjorourke]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

What if they post nekkid pictures of themselves?.

If female, that might be different.

[atlcomedy]

I applaud AZ. This may not be a perfect bill but it will force discussion and action on the larger issue.

I'm pragmatic enough to recognize the important role the illegals play in our workforce. I'm open to some sort of long term guest worker program if they play by the rules. In fact that status would actually open up more opportunities to them.

I don't however like the current situation and I firmly believe people shouldn't be rewarded for breaking the rules.

I've got a simple solution: When you find an illegal, you swifly deport them. You quit looking the other way. It doesn't need to involve a big witch hunt or stopping people in the middle of the street and asking for papers.

If you want a job, you have to show papers. If you want to rent an apartment, you have to show papers for everyone residing there. Employers and landlords face serious penalties for violations (that is looking the other way). Interact with any government agency (including schools) & you must show papers. Hell if you just made parents show their papers to enroll their kids in school you'd fix the overcrowding problem in many districts real quick.

[vnurse]

What I find interesting is the fact that the "racial profiling" they speak of has been going on for YEARS!!! ESPECIALLY in rural areas of Texas!

The problems started when the media started yammering about it all over the place!

I am not completely certain which side of the fence I am on here but I get so tired of hearing it screamed about all over the TV!

Okay, that's my rant...slow deep breaths now...

[Marcus Aurelius]

Press 1 for English.
Press 2 to be deported.