I am concerned ....

[EasyWriter1967]

When I see so many great eccie providers advertising on CL and BP. Has anyone else noticed this? Makes me think we are dropping the ball as hobbyists.

[GP]

How exactly would we be dropping the ball. I don't think we can be held accountable either as a group or individually. I think we all hobby within our means, some more than others. I'm sure it is just simple economics. The supply may be high and the demand low. They may have to pursue other avenues of advertising to make ends meet.

[EasyWriter1967]

I just hate seeing the trend. Makes me think something is not right.

[Chloe]

Different areas are different about the whole CL/BP thing. For many traveling providers that has been their route for years and maybe still habit. For those girls and/or girls who have been out of the scene for a while and still think that's a good route it makes sense. Definatly not my choice, it is such a pain in the butt to deal with that!

The CL crackdown in the media does not propose anything going on in NY at the moment but of course just a matter of time.

[offshoredrilling]

Its been that way for a long time. More on BP over CL. I looked and it is the same ones that also did it from the old site most of us came from. I would not worry about it.

[viviantonight]

"dropping the ball as hobbyists"
You mean like giving less than $200 for an encounter?? Or staying with a provider for way more than the scheduled time and then calling $20 extra a tip???
hhhmmmm what about "mission impossible" wasn't the whole point of that getting the most that you can for the least amount that you can??? oh I mean finding the "diamond in the rough" before she goes pro and raises the rates....
If you truly are concerned ....PAY HER MORE!!!

[offshoredrilling]

I think he is saying we need to see you all more. So no need to place a ad anywhere. And you have a very good memory I see. But he did come to find it was a bad idea in the "mission impossible" thread.

[EasyWriter1967]

Mission Impossible was a terrible idea. I have a long history of learning things the hard way. And an even longer history of not resisting temptation. The thought behind Mission Impossible was not for me to get more for less. It was routed in a desire for more information. There are tons of women advertising on CL and BP, and some of them are very tempting. My "mission" was to provide information about the bad ones. Spotlight the good ones and recruit them to eccie. And explore ways to satisfy my own desires and curiousity.

Lesson learned, for the most part.

The thought behind this thread is to get a better understanding of what is happening in the industry (and with this site). It baffles me that well reviewed and celebrated providers are taking the step down to BP & CL status. Eccie is an incredible tool. I like to think it is safer and provides a better client than BP or CL. But it seems like it and other respectable venues are not providing enough clients to support the women we know and care about.

Am I wrong?

Maybe, but I doubt it.

So, the question is, is there something that can be done about it? I don't think charging more or tipping more is the answer. (Although I encourage everyone to tip generously.) Increased prices would probably exacerbate the problem.

Here is what I think. These boards often talk about bringing new providers to the site, but I wonder if we should start focusing some on bringing more hobbyists on board. And that is another challenge. I am sure most people keep their hobby to themselves. With that in mind, how do we bring more safe, respectable and financially stable guys to the table? And in the process maintain the intregrity of the site, its hobbyists, and its providers.

Vivian, I don't know you. If I said something that upset you, I'm sorry. I am what I am. I am just trying to figure out what's going on ... if anything is going on at all.

Here is my other thought. I would hate to see eccie.net go the way of escorts.com, where more and more BP and CL advertisers have been swarming the site. But that is another discussion altogether....

[NormalBob]

Originally Posted by EasyWriter1967

I just hate seeing the trend. Makes me think something is not right.

It sounds like your perspective has evolved a good deal in the past four months:

http://www.eccie.net/showthread.php?...ion+impossible

There was some concern then about whether you were treating providers with respect. Whatever that was, hopefully that's now a dead issue.

Initially I had thought ECCIE could be a community.

That doesn't seem to have happened yet and may never happen.

Seems like the best one can try for is to do the best he or she can. Maybe a "Lead by example" approach will drag a friend or two with you in a positive direction.

I wouldn't have a clue how to add hobbyists, good or bad ones.

There are probably 400 hobbyists with accounts in WNY. I'm just guessing though. Well over 90% appear to be dedicated lurkers. Given that, you'll never know the shape of the iceberg below the water.

It seems like the providers have had a number of bad experiences with eccie hobbyists so membership in this club is NOT a Good Seal of Approval.

Unfortunately it only takes one bad experience to start to spoil the barrel.

[GP]

Originally Posted by EasyWriter1967

So, the question is, is there something that can be done about it?

IMHO, I do not think so. I see this as more a "nature of the beast" type of thing. It seems like you are putting WAY too much thought into this. Sit back, relax and enjoy the ride. Let the providers do as they wish. Believe me, they know their OWN business better than we do.

[NormalBob]

Originally Posted by GP

IMHO, I do not think so. I see this as more a "nature of the beast" type of thing.

While chopping the tree to pieces that fell overnight, these other couple of thoughts came to me.

1. When I first transitioned from a guy that began to describe himself as a "hobbyist" instead of a guy that had money burning a hole in his pocket right about crotch level, I had stereotypes about providers. It took awhile to figure out I had stereotypes about hobbyists too. Let's call these stereotypes "fantasies". Interestingly the fantasies about the providers dropped away faster than those I had about other hobbyists. It may be because I had more contact with them and that the guys I did meet were all pretty good guys.

In any case, the fantasy about a good group of guys gathering around a given internet site to swap information for each others good as well as for the good of the providers began to evaporate rapidly in about January (approximately four months in). Hearing about unnamed guys who roughed the providers up, pushed their physical boundaries, attempted bareback sex, underpaid and otherwise insulted the providers was a real wake up call. Those axxholes are in the small minority I'd hope but it doesn't take many to queer the whole environment.

2. As a result, ECCIE is not a "community" as much as it is just another website composed primarily with people seeking their own self-interest. Where you see people operating in ways more communally beneficial than raw self-interest, then you have some examples of exceptions rather than the rule.

[jackfengshui]

Most people probably do join a site such as this out of self-interest as a consumer or service provider. Some, however, eventually see its value as a "community" in which the members can exchange their thoughts and even concern for one another as human beings. Easywriter appears to have made that transition.

[NormalBob]

Originally Posted by jackfengshui

Most people probably do join a site such as this out of self-interest as a consumer or service provider. Some, however, eventually see its value as a "community" in which the members can exchange their thoughts and even concern for one another as human beings.

2. As a result, ECCIE is not a "community" as much as it is just another website composed primarily with people seeking their own self-interest. Where you see people operating in ways more communally beneficial than raw self-interest, then you have some examples of exceptions rather than the rule.

I think you and I just said the same thing two different ways.

Easywriter appears to have made that transition.

Sounds like it.

[offshoredrilling]

Yes Easywriter appears to have made that transition.

Providers that do ad's on CL and BP that also are on ECCIE and e.com and others, still do screening. Each having there own way of doing that. No screening way is perfect. But each provider doing what works for them. One way is you have to give the names of other providers you have met. Then the provider asks the others if he is ok. This dos work most of the time, yet I do know of one time that it did not.

So are they stepping down doing ads on CL or BP. Not really. Just getting name out to more buyers. Many that have started on CL but then to e.com. So on e.com you have the cream and the whey. CL and BP more whey, less cream. ECCIE almost all cream. And as GP said they know how to run things better than us, and what works for them. Now I got to make a call for a glass of milk. Whole milk that is. Not a fan of skim or whey.

[NormalBob]

Originally Posted by offshoredrilling

Now I got to make a call for a glass of milk.

No whey.