Redistribution of wealth

[heidilynnla]

So, I have a job in RL. I went to file Turbo-tax and all I can say is ouch. I paid how much in taxes and I'm getting $400 back? WTF? Meanwhile, people paying next to nothing into the system are getting $6000-$8000. How is it a refund if you never paid it in the first place?

Although not realistic, makes me want to provide full time and give a big F-U to Uncle Sam. Anyone else feeling it?

[London Rayne]

I won't say what I claim, but I normally get a nice refund being so much of my income goes to Church and Charity....automatic write off lol.

I am also a single mom who is in grad school, so that also helps. I can't explain why things are the way they are girl, but do wish you luck. I don't think you're alone in feeling this way.

[topsgt38801]

The poor pay nothing because they make nothing and the wealthiest pay nothing because they have all the loopholes. Teh folks in the middle are footing the bills. The same way with large companies. GE paid about 3% in US taxes because they are in so well with the current administration and have off shore shelters that keep them from paying taxes.

[topsgt38801]

London has a point, if you give a lot of charitables and have kids and mortgages, etc you also get breaks and refunds. People like myself with no children at home and mortgage paid for even with charitable contributions, I pay through the A-- all year and then still have to pay at end of the year. You work towards your retirement years and get out of debt and save a little money and Uncle Sam robs you blind. Getting close to Social Security and in my research, in my case, even after paying social security all these years, I will continue to do so even when I am drawing social security. you figure it!

Even though I am moaning about it, we still live in the best country in the world! I will just grin and bear it.

Top

[heidilynnla]

For now

[heidilynnla]

I don't mind them paying "nothing" if they make nothing, I just don't feel they need my money. I earned it. How can you get more back than you paid? Its called a refund.

[topsgt38801]

Been trying to figure that one out myself for many years and have not come up with an adequate response beside as you say a redistribution of wealth. Ours!

[Laurentius]

Originally Posted by heidilynnla

I don't mind them paying "nothing" if they make nothing, I just don't feel they need my money. I earned it. How can you get more back than you paid? Its called a refund.

This is the "earned income credit" and is a form of reverse taxation in that you get a "refund" that exceeds the taxes you paid in.

There is another name for this phenomenon that might explain it better: Welfare a/k/a Redistribution of Wealth a/k/a "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs."

[TexTushHog]

Originally Posted by topsgt38801

. . . and the wealthiest pay nothing because they have all the loopholes.

I don't think I among "the wealthiest," but I can assure you from my personal experience that those who make a lot, pay significant income taxes. I'm sending off a healthy mid six figures to the IRS this year. My fondest wish is that it was seven figures, instead, since that would mean that I would have made about three times as much money. Alas, I have yet to pay the IRS over $1,000,000 in any given year, but I keep tying to!!! And the year I do, you won't hear me complain one bit. I'll be as happy as a pig in shit.

As for the negative income tax at the low end of the income distribution, this is actually a great anti-poverty program that has, until recent years, been endorsed by both conservatives such as Milton Friedman, and many liberals. It is only in this day and time that conservatives object to helping out those who make modest sums. As one who has richly been blessed (in part because I work hard, but in part because of many factors over which I had no control), I have no objection to this at all. It beats the hell out of the government paying for needless wars with my tax dollars.

[heidilynnla]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

I don't think I among "the wealthiest," but I can assure you from my personal experience that those who make a lot, pay significant income taxes. I'm sending off a healthy mid six figures to the IRS this year. My fondest wish is that it was seven figures, instead, since that would mean that I would have made about three times as much money. Alas, I have yet to pay the IRS over $1,000,000 in any given year, but I keep tying to!!! And the year I do, you won't hear me complain one bit. I'll be as happy as a pig in shit.

As for the negative income tax at the low end of the income distribution, this is actually a great anti-poverty program that has, until recent years, been endorsed by both conservatives such as Milton Friedman, and many liberals. It is only in this day and time that conservatives object to helping out those who make modest sums. As one who has richly been blessed (in part because I work hard, but in part because of many factors over which I had no control), I have no objection to this at all. It beats the hell out of the government paying for needless wars with my tax dollars.

Oh darling. Spend a week with me in New Orleans. After you see the system abuse I see on a daily basis, surely your bleeding heart would be mended. In the meantime, I'm happy to be your charity case, lol

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by heidilynnla

So, I have a job in RL. I went to file Turbo-tax and all I can say is ouch. I paid how much in taxes and I'm getting $400 back? WTF? Meanwhile, people paying next to nothing into the system are getting $6000-$8000. How is it a refund if you never paid it in the first place?

Although not realistic, makes me want to provide full time and give a big F-U to Uncle Sam. Anyone else feeling it?

You aren't giving a big F-U to Uncle Sam, you are giving it to me and everyone else on here that pays was is statutorily required of us.

Pay what you owe...

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

You aren't giving a big F-U to Uncle Sam, you are giving it to me and everyone else on here that pays was is statutorily required of us.

Pay what you owe...

+1

I agree with my Dad. His philosophy was that his taxes were a very small price to pay for all the benefits: free education, an excellent highway system, SSA, Medicare, Medicaid, support for higher education, and a lot of other benefits. There are countries that have more benefits than the US, but the tax is higher. Some of them are ranked very high on the list of "best countries in which to live."

Although I feel the pinch every year, I feel it is a small price to pay.

[Iaintliein]

Originally Posted by topsgt38801

The poor pay nothing because they make nothing and the wealthiest pay nothing because they have all the loopholes. Teh folks in the middle are footing the bills. The same way with large companies. GE paid about 3% in US taxes because they are in so well with the current administration and have off shore shelters that keep them from paying taxes.

Companies don't pay taxes, their customers do. It is absolutely impossible to tax a company. Do you seriously think a company doesn't add the cost of tax right along with labor and raw materials in their prices???

By the way, the 5% with the highest income pays almost 60% of the federal income tax.

As per the OP's question. They may call it a refund, but those who don't pay and get money back are obviously receiving welfare (what the socialists call "redistribution").

[pjorourke]

Originally Posted by Iaintliein

By the way, the 5% with the highest income pays almost 60% of the federal income tax.

The ones with the highest incomes are not necessarily the wealthiest.

[Iaintliein]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

The ones with the highest incomes are not necessarily the wealthiest.

Exactly. And that points out a major problem with the income tax system. Those who are wealthy without the need for income pay nothing.

A national sales tax with a standard refund of some amount to cover taxes on food etc.would change this. It would also change the way America does business, the never ending, usually unproductive business travel with expensive hotels and dining would no longer be deductible.

All of the wealth in the world does nothing for it's holder unless it is invested (producing taxable income) or spent. If income isn't taxed there might be an added incentive to invest, otherwise, there would be no escaping the tax man if it's spent.

An old story, not especially related, but this is as good a place as any to insert it:

A businessman puts a $100 bill on the front desk of a small town hotel. "Here is a deposit, I want to see the room first before I decide to stay here."
As soon as he went up stairs the clerk grabbed the bill and ran to the meat market to pay his bill of credit with the butcher.
The butcher ran to the feed store with the same bill to pay his grain bill.
The feed store owner rushed to pay the farmer who grew the grain.
The farmer hurried to pay the escort who had graciously extended him credit.
Finally, the escort laid the $100 bill on the front desk to pay for the room she had been using, just before the businessman reclaimed the deposit having decided not to stay.

All bills paid, with no net change in who owned the $100 bill, yet the butcher, the feed store owner, the farmer and the hotel all had to pay taxes.