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Sensia · 10-20-2011, 10:06 AM

It used to be that the plan for getting old comfortably in America had three pillars -- your pension, your savings and Social Security.
Pensions: As Rachel explained last night on the show, pensions are on their way out. They're being replaced by 401k's, in which ordinary workers get tax breaks for gambling their money on Wall Street, to Wall Street's advantage.
Savings: Americans have essentially stopped saving money. With interest rates so low, you can't grow money by leaving it in the bank; the incentive is to gamble it on Wall Street.
Social Security: Republicans continue talking about overhauling Social Security, sometimes as personal investment accounts that mean more gambling on Wall Street, sometimes just as a Ponzi scheme that can't be counted on.

Discuss this post
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Quote: Nelda Dee

"I still can't get over how much 'pension extinction' looks like 'penis extension.'

Quote: M. Fehrman

"You may be confusing the chart with the "dicks" that did this to us".

Quote: HungryHerbert

"I have to say as a member of the younger generation I am not seeing any bright comfortable future. never have since I got my reality check (graduated high school, lost my father, uncle, brother, grandparents, best friend, etc. etc.) All I hope is that if I end up having children that they can invision a future for their children, Thats the only comfort we get in life is our childhood. I am taking my money out of the banks, Refusing to use a 401k, And am going to put it all in a box under my mattress.... at least there it won't shrink on me like it does in the bank...."

Quote: Bob in Texas -1456380

"If you are a 1%'er you can be assured your kids will do fine."

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_new...t-get-older-ok

Little Stevie · 10-20-2011, 02:53 PM

Your charts are almost as sexy as your showcase pictures! Both are a cut above! What a great take on the information stupid people seldom fathom.

CuteOldGuy · 10-20-2011, 03:10 PM

Who should be responsible for our retirement? The government? God help us.

Sensia · 10-20-2011, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Little Stevie

Your charts are almost as sexy as your showcase pictures! Both are a cut above! What a great take on the information stupid people seldom fathom.

Oh you flatter me..lol

Maybe someday in the future we should meet for coffee and talk about all things worldly ..! *wink*

xoxo
GP

MOCHAakaMOCHA · 10-20-2011, 04:44 PM

I'm getting dyslexia....I kept seeing penises lol

TexTushHog · 10-20-2011, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Who should be responsible for our retirement? The government? God help us.

It's worked for 80 years of so to have the government be responsible for a small part of our retirement -- just enough to keep everybody who either doesn't make enough to provide for their own retirement or for those who aren't sophisticated or lucky enough to invest well from starving. Social Security is a safety net that keeps the wolf away from the door. I'll retire with lots more if trends hold.

But having Social Security as a back up isn't a bad thing for me. And many have nothing else through no fault of their own. Many of my clients make minimum wage or minimum wage and work part time. They simply don't have enough to save since they live hand to mouth even in the best of times. Do you really think that they can save for their own retirement? Do you really think that they can defer gratification and save? Do you really think that they, many of whom have less than a high school education, can invest safely? No likely on any account.

Doove · 10-20-2011, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Do you really think that they can save for their own retirement? Do you really think that they can defer gratification and save? Do you really think that they, many of whom have less than a high school education, can invest safely?

Of course he does.

CuteOldGuy · 10-20-2011, 10:47 PM

Gee. How awful I must be. Expecting someone to be responsible for himself. If you want to help those people, go ahead. Nothing is stopping you. Why take money I have earned, and give it to someone else just because he "needs it more"? People used to depend on family, church or other private programs to help them. If we got the government out of our pockets by demanding a reasonable tax policy, there would be enough for all to take care of themselves. Government created this dependent class in order to guarantee a Democrat majority for years to come, according to FDR. It was never about help or compassion, like most everything else government does it's about POWER.

TexTushHog · 10-20-2011, 11:08 PM

Private charity can no more afford to pay for every poor person's retirement than it can afford to end hunger in America. That's a horrible cop out.

And it has nothing to do with being "responsible." I represent a guy right now who is borderline retarded, completed sixth grade, but works at minimum wage for about 24 hours a week. He has an apartment he shares with two siblings, but neither of them work full time. They have one beat up car between the two of them that was destroyed in an auto accident. The blue book value of the car was about $1,500 and the insurance company is jacking them around about paying that because they didn't have a clean title to the car. How are folks like that supposed to save? Hell, they're barely able to keep body and soul together. They go to a small country church, but everyone in the church is nearly as poor as they are. Nobody in the church is willing (or probably can) advance them the $1,500 to get a new used car. How the hell is anybody going to privately finance their retirement.

And as to why money you earned should go to help these folks, it's because you won the fucking genetic lottery. You won the ability lottery. And because if you (and I) don't do it, no one will and they are our fellow human beings. We are our brothers' keeper. You judge a society by how it treats its most vulnerable members just as Christian ethics says "Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me."

I B Hankering · 10-20-2011, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Private charity can no more afford to pay for every poor person's retirement than it can afford to end hunger in America. That's a horrible cop out.

And it has nothing to do with being "responsible." I represent a guy right now who is borderline retarded, completed sixth grade, but works at minimum wage for about 24 hours a week. He has an apartment he shares with two siblings, but neither of them work full time. They have one beat up car between the two of them that was destroyed in an auto accident. The blue book value of the car was about $1,500 and the insurance company is jacking them around about paying that because they didn't have a clean title to the car. How are folks like that supposed to save? Hell, they're barely able to keep body and soul together. They go to a small country church, but everyone in the church is nearly as poor as they are. Nobody in the church is willing (or probably can) advance them the $1,500 to get a new used car. How the hell is anybody going to privately finance their retirement.

And as to why money you earned should go to help these folks, it's because you won the fucking genetic lottery. You won the ability lottery. And because if you (and I) don't do it, no one will and they are our fellow human beings. We are our brothers' keeper. You judge a society by how it treats its most vulnerable members just as Christian ethics says "Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me."

TTH quoting scripture? How much are you charging your "broke clients" for your services, or will it be a business loss on your taxes?

CuteOldGuy · 10-20-2011, 11:30 PM

Christian charity is based in individual compassion, not forced compassion. Jesus was not interested in government reformation but personal transformation. There is no blessing promised to someone who takes another's money to give it to someone else.

I didn't win any lottery. I made bad choices, and lost a bundle. My own fault, no one else's. I'm not asking the government for anything. When I practiced law, I represented those people for free. I donated my time and money to causes I felt were worthwhile. I still donate time. The problem is that now whenever we see a problem, we think government is the only solution. Government should be the resource of last resort, not first. And then, this belongs in the states, not the Feds.

Considering myself to be my brother's keeper is pretty damn condescending to my brother.

CuteOldGuy · 10-20-2011, 11:32 PM

never mind

dilbert firestorm · 10-21-2011, 03:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

never mind

never mind what?

TexTushHog · 10-21-2011, 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

TTH quoting scripture? How much are you charging your "broke clients" for your services, or will it be a business loss on your taxes?

I'm not charging these folks anything because it's a property damage only case. I'm just helping them because they're getting dicked around.

And to my knowledge, you can't deduct pro bono services on a businesses tax returns. Perhaps COG can correct me on that. But the lawyer (and legal assistant) that is working on the case is on salary. She is paid by the month and gets bonuses when the firm does well. Her salary is deductible whether she works on pro bono cases, million dollar law suits, or surf for porn on the internet all day. How would it "be a business loss on [my] taxes"? Inquiring minds want to know.

Doove · 10-21-2011, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Considering myself to be my brother's keeper is pretty damn condescending to my brother.

Oh please. Look at all the people in the world who are starving. Charity my ass.

Are you kidding me with this claptrap?

Sorry, but anyone in here who claims to be benevolent themselves while at the same time arguing against government benevolence, frankly, i think is lying. Yeah, i said it. So you can save it when it comes to trying to convince us how thoughtful and caring you are. I'm not buying it.