George Zimmerman Arrested -- Finally!!

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Here is what I believe is the best article written so far regarding the case.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/17/us...-missteps.html

In another news article concerning the autopsy of Trayvon Martin, he was shot from "an intermediate distance". No explanation of what an "intermediate distance" was. Also, Martin had bruising on his knuckles which would be consistent with him punching Zimmerman.

[F-Sharp]

Actually, what the report says they found from the Martin autopsy is "...an abrasion, no more than a quarter-inch in size, on his left ring finger below the knuckle." Again, not consistent with Zimmerman's account of being "punched" and having his head "bashed". Any single person who has ever gone toe to toe with another human being knows this to be true. Fingers are nearly always cut and often broken when applying repeated blows to one's skull.

Anyone want to place a bet on Martin being right or left handed?

"An intermediate range gunshot, like that seen in the above image, can range from just beyond the 12-inch range out to 24 to 36 inches. This depends greatly upon the caliber, barrel length and powder type used in the ammunition."

http://www.firearmsid.com/A_distanceResults.htm

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

Here is what I believe is the best article written so far regarding the case.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/17/us...-missteps.html

In another news article concerning the autopsy of Trayvon Martin, he was shot from "an intermediate distance". No explanation of what an "intermediate distance" was. Also, Martin had bruising on his knuckles which would be consistent with him punching Zimmerman.

[irishlad]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

Factual corrections here are completely unnecessary, let's try using just a little common sense.

OK

I don't know who "Williams" is, but I assume you mean Martin. 50/50? There's no question in my mind Zimmerman confronted this kid. The very fact that there was an altercation between them, whatever that altercation actually was is proof alone of this.

Yes I meant Martin. I had Trayvon Williams in my mind for some reason.

No question? Really? That's pure personal bias as you have no way to know that. There was a confrontation, there is no way of knowing who initiated it. Zimmerman claims it was Martin.

Again, I don't know who "Williams" is, but the only way Martin could have known Zimmerman had a gun would have been to confront Martin and either show him he had a gun, or threaten him with it's use. Either way, Zimmerman would have been in the wrong.

The only way? If Zimmerman's account is right and Martin jumped him then knocked him to the ground, the holster could easily have become visible at that point.


If Martin did get physical first, that means that 1. Zimmerman did indeed approach and confront Martin in some form or fashion. Martin could have very well felt his life was in danger by the white/hispanic guy with ADHD carrying a sidearm and approaching him for no reason. Did Martin not have a right to "Stand your ground" against the guy with the gun?

It does not follow that Martin could have only gotten physical if approached by Zimmerman. Martin could have approached Zimmerman, which is what Zimmerman says happened.


Actually, that's the very definition of racism. Some people are just too blind or too ignorant to see just how racist they really are. Think about what you said for a moment and tell me what exactly is any more suspicious about a black guy in a hoodie than a white guy in a golf shirt and khakis? Racism and prejudice is in fact the only thing that separates the two.

I think you need to learn more about the definition of racism. Racism is based on ignorance, but several stories researching this story reported that teenage black kids were seen committing crimes in the neighborhood. He MIGHT have profiled this guy in his mind, but profiling is not racism. Nor can "feeling suspicious" be a racist act even according to the liberal academic activists who define the word.

Look at all of the conclusions you are leaping to. You have a narrative in your mind. Probably fits your views on society and the world. You're making this incident fit your narrative when really you don't know much at all about what really happened that night any more than you know what kind of people Zimmerman and Martin are.

[Dr. Pecker]

I have a much easier time believing that trayvon punched zimmerman for asking what he was up to rather than zimmerman gunning him down just for the hell of it. I've talked to so many people who honestly believe zimmerman had no injuries, and that trayvon was a 12 year old who was shot in the back.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Dr. Pecker

I have a much easier time believing that trayvon punched zimmerman for asking what he was up to rather than zimmerman gunning him down just for the hell of it. I've talked to so many people who honestly believe zimmerman had no injuries, and that trayvon was a 12 year old who was shot in the back.

DP,

much of the early information on the case would lead people to believe just about anything.

No one has stated that Zimmerman gunned down Martin "just for the hell of it". There was an altercation between the two. No one know how it started. Did Zimmerman confront Martin or vice versa? Did Martin just start beating on Zimmerman or did Zimmerman do something that made Martin fear for his own life? No one knows the circumstances under which Zimmerman shot Martin. Was Zimmerman still on the ground or had he gotten out from under Martin (assuming Martin did have Zimmerman on the ground and was beating his head into the cement)?

[F-Sharp]

Originally Posted by irishlad

Look at all of the conclusions you are leaping to. You have a narrative in your mind. Probably fits your views on society and the world. You're making this incident fit your narrative when really you don't know much at all about what really happened that night any more than you know what kind of people Zimmerman and Martin are.

Is it really your belief that Martin approached Zimmerman completely out of the blue, and for absolutely no reason this 17 year old kid started beating on a 28 year old man? That is is seriously nothing short of delusional.

You're completely missing the point, in that if an altercation took place, it's is the single fault of Zimmerman for stalking and ultimately approaching this kid when he had absolutely no good reason to do so.

You can call it what you like, prejudice is prejudice! Zimmerman saw a young black kid in a hoodie and automatically concluded he was up to no good. I don't know how much more racist one can possibly be. Now stop trying to tell the world up is down and left is right. No one's buying it.

[irishlad]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

Is it really your belief that Martin approached Zimmerman completely out of the blue, and for absolutely no reason this 17 year old kid started beating on a 28 year old man? That is is seriously nothing short of delusional.

You're completely missing the point, in that if an altercation took place, it's is the single fault of Zimmerman for stalking and ultimately approaching this kid when he had absolutely no good reason to do so.

You can call it what you like, prejudice is prejudice! Zimmerman saw a young black kid in a hoodie and automatically concluded he was up to no good. I don't know how much more racist one can possibly be. Now stop trying to tell the world up is down and left is right. No one's buying it.

It is not unusual for someone in the neighborhood watch to ... watch. It is not illegal to watch someone walking in a neighborhood at night.

It is speculation that Zimmerman was suspicious about Martin's "blackness"... he didn't say why he was suspicious.

We do know that Martin knew he was being followed and was nervous about it because of his phone call to his gf. Zimmerman's story - for which there is no conflicting evidence - is that when told "we don't need you to follow him" he headed back to his car, at which point he was accosted by Martin who didn't like being followed.

I said it's 50:50. Only you seem to suffer from the delusion of certainty.

[Artist Formally Known As]

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

Now THAT is the worst statement I've read in this thread. Here is a young man returning home from his father's girlfriend's house, talking to his girlfriend on the phone, and is now dead due to Zimmerman's actions, legal or not.

Someone who is killed is a tragic thing for sure. Unless you were there you have no idea what exactly transpired.

They are saying that the kid did have bloody and scratched up knuckles from the autopsy report.

IMO Zimmerman should have just waited for the cops to come and not get out and follow him.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Artist Formally Known As

Someone who is killed is a tragic thing for sure. Unless you were there you have no idea what exactly transpired.

They are saying that the kid did have bloody and scratched up knuckles from the autopsy report.

IMO Zimmerman should have just waited for the cops to come and not get out and follow him.

I fully agree with your last statement. What I was objecting to in the statement of mine you cited is that Dr Pecker implied Martin was in the neighborhood casing out homes for future burglaries. There is absolutely NOTHING to support that statement and is 100% incorrect based on all information released.

We do have a good idea what happened that night, right up to the time Zimmerman and Martin came face-to-face.

[Artist Formally Known As]

I just see that the media is playing out that Trayvon was this innocent kid in the pics they are showing that are several years old. The pics they show of Zimmerman all look like an ex convict. I have seen the pics of Trayvon that show him wearing gang type clothing and not as so sweet and innocent looking. Never judge a book by its cover.

So before being the judge and jury in the media let all the facts come out in a court of law.

[Dr. Pecker]

Zimmerman said to the 911 dispatcher that he was just wandering around aimlessly looking at houses. In the rain, no less. Seriously, is this not suspicious? Who takes a leisurely aimless sauntering walk on a cell phone in the rain? Electronics and water is not a combination that works well.

Many burglars do their burglaries in the rain due to the cover from the light and the noise. And its perfectly normal for someone to be running quickly in the rain in case one needs to get away.

[Spacemtn]

Originally Posted by Dr. Pecker

Zimmerman said to the 911 dispatcher that he was just wandering around aimlessly looking at houses. In the rain, no less. Seriously, is this not suspicious? Who takes a leisurely aimless sauntering walk on a cell phone in the rain? Electronics and water is not a combination that works well.

Many burglars do their burglaries in the rain due to the cover from the light and the noise. And its perfectly normal for someone to be running quickly in the rain in case one needs to get away.

You seem to have some very clear insights into the minds of criminals and how they think and when they prefer to engage in criminal activity.......HMMMMMMMMM..... .I wonder what makes you know so much???


Spacemtn
AustinModStaff

[F-Sharp]

Originally Posted by Artist Formally Known As

They are saying that the kid did have bloody and scratched up knuckles from the autopsy report.

No they're not saying that at all. All the reports I have read indicate he had a 1/8" - 1/4" abrasion just below the knuckle on his left hand ring finger. Hardly consistent with someone who was reported as dishing out blows to someone causing them to be in fear of their life. As if the "abrasion" was not enough to satisfy a reasonable, logical thinking person...was Martin left or right handed? Place your bets!

Originally Posted by Artist Formally Known As

I just see that the media is playing out that Trayvon was this innocent kid in the pics they are showing that are several years old. The pics they show of Zimmerman all look like an ex convict. I have seen the pics of Trayvon that show him wearing gang type clothing and not as so sweet and innocent looking. Never judge a book by its cover.

So before being the judge and jury in the media let all the facts come out in a court of law.

This is where I take serious issue. What Martin looked like, or what kind of clothes he was wearing has absolutely no bearing on this issue. The fact remains that Martin was doing ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong that night, much less illegal, and was shot and killed for no other reason than being a black kid wearing a hoodie. That's all there is to this case and anything that transpired from there on out was strictly due to Zimmerman's actions. Other than Zimmerman's own prejudice, there was no reason to stalk this kid. Listen to the 911 call, there was absolutely no doubt in Zimmerman's mind that this kid was up to no good. He based that on what exactly? Nothing more than the kid was black and wearing a hoodie? "Gang type" clothing? "Sweet and innocent looking"? Do you not hear yourself and your own prejudices? What you are implying is that anyone who does not look "sweet and innocent" or wears "gang type" clothing MUST be suspicious. This is EXACTLY the small-minded, ignorant, RACIST mentality that led Zimmerman to stalk and ultimately kill this kid for no reason.

As a side note, I am curious what you second amendment folks think about giving concealed weapons permits to folks who are taking psychiatric medication. Is this apparently okay with you folks and you take no issue with it? No one seems to be making any mention of the fact that Zimmerman has a well-documented history of violent and erratic behavior, and was indeed taking psychiatric meds the night he shot and killed Martin.

[Billy_Saul]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

Hardly consistent with someone who was reported as dishing out blows to someone causing them to be in fear of their life.

"He witnesses a black male, wearing a dark colored 'hoodie' on top of a white or Hispanic male and throwing punches 'MMA (mixed martial arts) style," the police report of the witness said. "He then heard a pop. He stated that after hearing the pop, he observed the person he had previously observed on top of the other person (the male wearing the hoodie) laid out on the grass."

"A second witness described a person on the ground with another straddling him and throwing punches. The man on the bottom was yelling for help, the witness told police"

"In addition, Trayvon Martin's father told an investigator after listening to 911 tapes that captured a man's voice frantically callling for help that it was not his son calling for help. "

http://abcnews.go.com/US/cops-witnes...2#.T7WAy1K3NJE

Complete waste of tax payer money. The state will never get a conviction in this case. This is why the special prosecutor did not present this case to a grand jury. A no-bill would defeat her opportunity to pursue a political prosecution.

[sixxbach]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

and for absolutely no reason this 17 year old kid started beating on a 28 year old man? That is is seriously nothing short of delusional.

I am not saying it happened in this case, but if you don't think there are 17 year olds out there who would start beating on a 28 year old man or anyone for no reason, you are the delusional one

sixx