US Credit Rating....tick..tick..tick

[pjorourke]

There was a question in your mind?

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

The solution is very simple. Cut everything!!!

Let's start with tax advantages to corporations.

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

Let's start with tax advantages to corporations.

obviously, you don't have to respond...

but in broad terms....what is your net worth/retirement comprised of?

are you secretly an alpaca farmer? is that your secret?

some of us have diversification/allocation issues...but WE own these "big corporations"

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

I just wanted to see if you had any idea of what you were talking about when you said "Loopholes". I think I got my answer.

There you go thinking again Rudyard.

A Loophole to one might be considered incentive to another. Yes , I can put myself in others shoes. I've seen you ask others to do so too, try it sometime and you might not have to ask such silly questions that draw erroneous conclusions on your part. Bless your heart.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

obviously, you don't have to respond...

but in broad terms....what is your net worth/retirement comprised of?

are you secretly an alpaca farmer? is that your secret?

some of us have diversification/allocation issues...but WE own these "big corporations"

Look just because you invest in one don't mean I gotta like them not paying taxes.

Here is how it works atl....when one segment of society see's another not paying their fair share they have a tendency not to want to pay theirs.

Poor folks get hit hardest with a regressive tax so don't go there.

That leaves the middle class shouldering the bulk of the load. They ever figure out that it is the rich fuc'n them not the poor there will be a new dawn in this country , not just the Middle East.

[Rudyard K]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

Let's start with tax advantages to corporations.

Seriously CT. I think you are sincere...even if I think you are misquided. But if you really want to play in this pool you've got to step a little deeper in than the steps. Tell us something?...anything?...you know, with a bit more defintion than "loopholes" and "tax advantages". You might find there is more agreement than you think about certain issues.

So, what's your bitch about corporate taxes? What are they getting to deduct (i.e. reduce their income) that you don't think they should?

[Rudyard K]

Originally Posted by WTF

A Loophole to one might be considered incentive to another.

Well, that's kind of a big "No Duh!!". I didn't ask you to define the word. I asked you which ones you were talking about.

Maybe the only loopholes you really know, are the ones you string your laces through when you're trying on someone else's shoes.

If you don't know?..it's OK. Lots of folks don't either.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

If you don't know?..it's OK. Lots of folks don't either.

I know and I know you know I know.

I can live with dat.

[WTF]

Speaking of loopholes the capital gains tax rate which dropped from 28% to 20% in 1997, and from 20% to 15% in 2003 makes it where the oh say 400 wealthiest tax payers among us pay oh say an effective tax rate of ?????????????????. Lets just guess wtf the rate is among the job creators. Take a guess you tax cutters! Guess wtf the average rate is on those wealth creators that need Q1 and Q2 to keep their market gains up, lets guess wtf their average tax rate is.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

Let's start with tax advantages to corporations.

Charles just tell these knuckleheads that corporations are doing the same fucking thing the folks that pay no taxes are doing. They are just playing within the rules. Yet the other sides cries like a stuck hog about those poor bastards not paying anything.

[Can I Play Too???]

Originally Posted by WTF

Charles just tell these knuckleheads that corporations are doing the same fucking thing the folks that pay no taxes are doing. They are just playing within the rules. Yet the other sides cries like a stuck hog about those poor bastards not paying anything.

What tax loop holes? Companies go off-shore to avoid paying taxes. Examples: Ikea, Nike, apple...

They can pay slave wages to increase profit margin. It's called, "globalization".

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

Can we agree (for about the 30th time lol) on 2 things:

Ultimately:

1) Any taxes, big company/small company/public/private/GE/Mom&Pop....ultimately get bourne by the consumer....

2) Public/Big Companies are owned by all of us directly or indirectly. Sure they may pay executives huge amounts but the profits they deliver (by hook or crook) accrue to us.

Originally Posted by WTF

Look just because you invest in one don't mean I gotta like them not paying taxes.

Here is how it works atl....when one segment of society see's another not paying their fair share they have a tendency not to want to pay theirs.

Poor folks get hit hardest with a regressive tax so don't go there.

That leaves the middle class shouldering the bulk of the load. They ever figure out that it is the rich fuc'n them not the poor there will be a new dawn in this country , not just the Middle East.

1) Taxes from big companies MAY get borne by the consumer. But not by EVERY consumer since every consumer doesn't partake equally of every big corporation. The fact that big corps pay NO/LITTLE taxes compared to their income may help folks like you (increased return on shares) who own parts of the corps, but not everyone owns shares, so that's no incentive to a lot of citizens. But I don't think the answer to the current US fiscal crisis is to allow big corps to continue to cut out the US Treasury from its money making role in the US. Corps make money here and should pay for that privilege with full, not decreased, taxes.

2) Let's assume a person owns 100 shares of XYZ corp. Look at the list of corp stock you own and pick the most profitable one for last year. Then tell me in dollars and cents how much someone with 100 shares is going to make in one year on your most profitable company. It ain't much, I'd wager. And the "US" you refer to is shareholders, which is HARDLEY the whole population. As a matter of fact, compared to the whole population, the number of actual shareholder is a small percentage. So, the benefits do NOT accrue to "all of us," but only to a few. And, I would be willing to bet a fair amount of money, those few are mostly in the upper 10% of the income brackets.

Bottom line, atl, your position is taken out of your own greed. If the corps continue to avoid US taxes and paying the US Treasury, that's more net and more profit for you, personally. The average Joe doesn't see any benefit to this system...only the downside because he has to pay into the Treasury that which the corps avoided.

I hate to say it, but John Edwards was right. There's rich America and poor America. And just because he was caught doing what everyone on this board does, does not mean he wasn't right about the duality of the country.

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

1) Taxes from big companies MAY get borne by the consumer. But not by EVERY consumer since every consumer doesn't partake equally of every big corporation. The fact that big corps pay NO/LITTLE taxes compared to their income may help folks like you (increased return on shares) who own parts of the corps, but not everyone owns shares, so that's no incentive to a lot of citizens. But I don't think the answer to the current US fiscal crisis is to allow big corps to continue to cut out the US Treasury from its money making role in the US. Corps make money here and should pay for that privilege with full, not decreased, taxes.

2) Let's assume a person owns 100 shares of XYZ corp. Look at the list of corp stock you own and pick the most profitable one for last year. Then tell me in dollars and cents how much someone with 100 shares is going to make in one year on your most profitable company. It ain't much, I'd wager. And the "US" you refer to is shareholders, which is HARDLEY the whole population. As a matter of fact, compared to the whole population, the number of actual shareholder is a small percentage. So, the benefits do NOT accrue to "all of us," but only to a few. And, I would be willing to bet a fair amount of money, those few are mostly in the upper 10% of the income brackets.

Bottom line, atl, your position is taken out of your own greed. If the corps continue to avoid US taxes and paying the US Treasury, that's more net and more profit for you, personally. The average Joe doesn't see any benefit to this system...only the downside because he has to pay into the Treasury that which the corps avoided.

I hate to say it, but John Edwards was right. There's rich America and poor America. And just because he was caught doing what everyone on this board does, does not mean he wasn't right about the duality of the country.

Charles this is one of your silliest arguments yet...what happen?? the shift manager at the Embassy Suites get confused and put out the "Manager's Reception" items at breakfast time ???

Of course all of this is based on macroeconomics. It assumes that an average consumer's "shopping cart" over the course of the year balances out between firms that pay high(er) and low(er) corporate taxes. Sure some individuals will have different experiences. Nothing is perfect.

And of course if you own fewer shares of a profitable corp your share of the earnings will be less. But if you own a million shares and I own 100 our proportionate returns are the same. No favortism for the big guy.

[Whirlaway]

How about "let's start with everything; including military, corporate welfare, farm programs, UN budget, food stamps, and yes entitlements (SS, medicare, medicaid), and government workers benefits.....

And Charles, for somebody who said he didn't care about this stuff because his vote doesn't count, you certainly have alot of ideas you want us to consider...just saying,

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

Let's start with tax advantages to corporations.