So You Want to "Arm" Teachers?

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

You do know you can use word search to see I never said 'traumatized. I said 'conditioned', much in the same way you used 'acclimated' - which is the same as 'conditioned'.

Recall the elephant training technique. They put a chain on one ankle of a baby elephant, which is strong enough to keep them from wondering more than a few feet. As they mature, they still use the same chain, just with a bigger ankle cuff, which the elephant could easily break. But since they were 'conditioned' when they were young, they still believe that that chain will restrain them.

FWIW: I'm a bold believer in layered security, much of which can be obscured from plain sight. Additionally, I'm for well trained and armed teachers, assuming they got what it takes. Most do not - IMHO. However, I am against 'conditioning' children to grow in a constant state of 'trauma' and fear - willing to accept the believe that big gubment will protect them at all times.

Most any security can be defeated, especially when the operators are inept or too scared to 'perform'their duty. But yes, I agree with you that the little urchins are being 'conditioned' to accept wanton violence via video games and Hollywood movies that do not yield real life consequences from the violence portrayed.

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Your comments about traumatizing "kiddies" in school by security measures .. is the same argument used against security measures in school by the Liberals....until there is a massacre. Unfortunately, the "kiddies" need to get acclimated to security around them ... recreational events, work places, and travel.

That's the world we now have and it won't get any better in their lifetimes. It's becoming a fact of life .. and with all due respect it has seemed from the media reporting the past year or so ... the hostile environment is being aggravated by the very same people who are criticizing security measures ....



Is someone mentioning "guns of war"?



What do you expect?

[gnadfly]

Before we tear each other up with insults I'd like to see a readout on the whole Boward School shooting incident. Although I'm no fan of "blue ribbon" commissions, it appears that there were a lot of failures of various people and organizations. This doesn't excuse or lessen what Cruz did but these failures need to be corrected before any laws enacted or major political action is taken.

First of all Cruz needs to held accountable.

Second, the FBI, the school superindent, local police chief, several local policemen and the local mental health officials failed. They need to held accountable in varying degrees. It appears that only one person retired, probably with a full pension.

Driving by the local KlienISD schools that were recently built, they look like prisons - literally.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Before we tear each other up with insults I'd like to see a readout on the whole Boward School shooting incident.

First of all Cruz needs to held accountable.

Second, the FBI, the school superindent, local police chief, several local policemen and the local mental health officials failed. They need to held accountable in varying degrees. It appears that only one person retired, probably with a full pension.

Driving by the local KlienISD schools that were recently built, they look like prisons - literally.

My guess is there will be no "commission" type investigation that is released to the public regarding that incident any time soon, if ever, irrespective of the best intentions and wishes of the Governor.

Cruz is being held .... accountable. He has taken responsibility.

The "prison" appearances can be as much for energy efficiency as security, and I suspect more for the energy issues. But actually, designs to control one are adaptable to control both. But one of the criticisms of the Boward pre-incident instructions was that the students were to remain in classrooms and not attempt to escape from the classroom windows ... so they were effectively "trapped" in classrooms by the administration's orders.

Where I went to high school we had a closed campus with fencing around it and it looked like a prison facility from the outside. But also on Monday morning the street in front of the school was full of city cop vehicles waiting for the "wanted ones" to arrive at school so they could take them to jail. It was "secure" there! I also believe Cruz would not have lasted long in the halls there.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

I would say I agree on all fronts. Though I am still waiting to see the very same thing on the Vegas mess, especially considering all of the video monitoring and regular player's club tracking they do there. Odd that no official surveillance video has surfaced yet. You ever been in their monitoring/security rooms? It's incredible the technologies they use. Then their is the whole regular player tracking systems on top of that. Not a single peep of the lunatics comings or goings, even though he had been there for several days leading up to the incident. Incredulous.

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Before we tear each other up with insults I'd like to see a readout on the whole Boward School shooting incident. Although I'm no fan of "blue ribbon" commissions, it appears that there were a lot of failures of various people and organizations. This doesn't excuse or lessen what Cruz did but these failures need to be corrected before any laws enacted or major political action is taken.

First of all Cruz needs to held accountable.

Second, the FBI, the school superindent, local police chief, several local policemen and the local mental health officials failed. They need to held accountable in varying degrees. It appears that only one person retired, probably with a full pension.

Driving by the local KlienISD schools that were recently built, they look like prisons - literally.

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

My guess is there will be no "commission" type investigation that is released to the public regarding that incident any time soon, if ever, irrespective of the best intentions and wishes of the Governor.

Cruz is being held .... accountable. He has taken responsibility.

The "prison" appearances can be as much for energy efficiency as security, and I suspect more for the energy issues. But actually, designs to control one are adaptable to control both. But one of the criticisms of the Boward pre-incident instructions was that the students were to remain in classrooms and not attempt to escape from the classroom windows ... so they were effectively "trapped" in classrooms by the administration's orders.

Where I went to high school we had a closed campus with fencing around it and it looked like a prison facility from the outside. But also on Monday morning the street in front of the school was full of city cop vehicles waiting for the "wanted ones" to arrive at school so they could take them to jail. It was "secure" there! I also believe Cruz would not have lasted long in the halls there.

I was looking at some photos of this school. The campus is rather spacious consisting of more than one building. It almost resembles a miniature college campus. Because of the overall layout I would have to surmise the security measures were quite inadequate because Cruz had no problem walking onto campus entering a classroom building all the time carrying a rifle and nobody ever saw him until he opened fired and then of course it was too late.

Jim

[themystic]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Before we tear each other up with insults I'd like to see a readout on the whole Boward School shooting incident. Although I'm no fan of "blue ribbon" commissions, it appears that there were a lot of failures of various people and organizations. This doesn't excuse or lessen what Cruz did but these failures need to be corrected before any laws enacted or major political action is taken.

First of all Cruz needs to held accountable.

Second, the FBI, the school superindent, local police chief, several local policemen and the local mental health officials failed. They need to held accountable in varying degrees. It appears that only one person retired, probably with a full pension.

Driving by the local KlienISD schools that were recently built, they look like prisons - literally.

Nice post gnadfly.

[themystic]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

My guess is there will be no "commission" type investigation that is released to the public regarding that incident any time soon, if ever, irrespective of the best intentions and wishes of the Governor.

Cruz is being held .... accountable. He has taken responsibility.

The "prison" appearances can be as much for energy efficiency as security, and I suspect more for the energy issues. But actually, designs to control one are adaptable to control both. But one of the criticisms of the Boward pre-incident instructions was that the students were to remain in classrooms and not attempt to escape from the classroom windows ... so they were effectively "trapped" in classrooms by the administration's orders.

Where I went to high school we had a closed campus with fencing around it and it looked like a prison facility from the outside. But also on Monday morning the street in front of the school was full of city cop vehicles waiting for the "wanted ones" to arrive at school so they could take them to jail. It was "secure" there! I also believe Cruz would not have lasted long in the halls there.

Lex you're pretty smart, but... the prison look is not an " energy efficient" design. I have background in design. You are mistaken friend

[the_real_Barleycorn]

How many teachers are molesting or having sex with students and yet we still put them in charge of children. Do I have to point out many teachers are liberals?

[dilbert firestorm]

we live in a different age where many teachers are liberals. in the old days most teachers were strict and conservative. harsh punishment and spanking were the norm, today that constitutes child abuse.

[garhkal]

Originally Posted by the_real_Barleycorn

How many teachers are molesting or having sex with students and yet we still put them in charge of children.

Or how many times have we heard of a school bus driver, having a prior kiddy diddling conviction on their record?!!

Just goes to show what LITTLE vetting they actually do.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by themystic

Lex you're pretty smart, but... the prison look is not an " energy efficient" design. I have background in design. You are mistaken friend

No I'm not. For instance the windows in the Broward school were installed for hurricane level winds ... not to prevent escape.

I've had experience in working with architects and engineers in discussing the design of public school buildings, including renovations, which required compliance with OSHA and EPA requirements ... none of which had a damn thing to do with security. In fact that was why I was talking to them. They were oblivious to the considerations.

I also have a long time business associate who has been in the "AC" business installing new units in new public school construction and renovations, and on numerous occasions we have discussed the FACT in how the changing designs have helped or hindered his installations and increased the costs.

Stick to picking mushrooms!

But since you keep bringing up "prisons" ... the "security measures" within are to deter escape, but the "security measures" around the perimeter are to monitor and control who enters.

For 50-60 years our buildings, residences, and transportation have been "re-designed" for "energy efficiency" and greater reliance upon artificial control of the environment within it. Security measures are SOMETIMES designed into them, but to keep people out not to keep people in. An old friend of mine began a side business of installing alarm equipment in commercial and residential buildings and having some hands on experience occasionally helping him with installations or responding to calls for service I recognized early on they were not built for "security"! Many people in many parts of this country don't even lock their doors ... still.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by dilbert firestorm

we live in a different age where many teachers are liberals. in the old days most teachers were strict and conservative. harsh punishment and spanking were the norm, today that constitutes child abuse.

The transition was legislatively and judicially driven based on a Liberal agenda, which resulted in teachers with a conservative and stricter attitude in classroom not being hired or quitting after they were REQUIRED to cater to the whims of the Liberals and the little turds families generated in the "Dr. Spock Era" of "feel good" parenting that spilled over into public schools.

Professionals who could bring quality education and instruction to the lives of many young people in this country were not interested in putting up with the shit holes being generated by the Liberals with their "kinder and gentler" approach to allowing young people to grow like suffocating weeds ... resulting in this shit ....



... they didn't pop out of the womb like that!

There are still parts of this country where schools are for educating young people and preparing them for a gainful adulthood, instead of being taxpayer funded day care centers until they are old enough to go away to college, the military, or to do nothing but live off the fat of the land.

An example of the "legislative/judicial" modification are the juvenile delinquency codes throughout the country that do nothing more than educate you people on how to beat the adult criminal system and that the adult criminal system doesn't work.

Until along in the 70's parents would support the teachers when little "Johnny" was a turd at school and with Dr. Spock's guidance and philosophy it morphed into being the "teachers' fault" because "little Johnny was a turd"!

[dilbert firestorm]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Until along in the 70's parents would support the teachers when little "Johnny" was a turd at school and with Dr. Spock's guidance and philosophy it morphed into being the "teachers' fault" because "little Johnny was a turd"!

that's what pretty much what my mother who is a retired teacher told me when dealing with child turds.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

No I'm not. For instance the windows in the Broward school were installed for hurricane level winds ... not to prevent escape.

I've had experience in working with architects and engineers in discussing the design of public school buildings, including renovations, which required compliance with OSHA and EPA requirements ... none of which had a damn thing to do with security. In fact that was why I was talking to them. They were oblivious to the considerations.

I also have a long time business associate who has been in the "AC" business installing new units in new public school construction and renovations, and on numerous occasions we have discussed the FACT in how the changing designs have helped or hindered his installations and increased the costs.

Stick to picking mushrooms!

But since you keep bringing up "prisons" ... the "security measures" within are to deter escape, but the "security measures" around the perimeter are to monitor and control who enters.

For 50-60 years our buildings, residences, and transportation have been "re-designed" for "energy efficiency" and greater reliance upon artificial control of the environment within it. Security measures are SOMETIMES designed into them, but to keep people out not to keep people in. An old friend of mine began a side business of installing alarm equipment in commercial and residential buildings and having some hands on experience occasionally helping him with installations or responding to calls for service I recognized early on they were not built for "security"! Many people in many parts of this country don't even lock their doors ... still.

MushroomStic, just for your edification ...

https://www.epa.gov/schools-healthy-...ciency-healthy

Facility and Efficiency Improvements Concerning Energy Efficiency for Healthy School Environments

Why It's Important

States spend more on energy than any other school-related expense, aside from personnel.

Even without significant investment, schools that target energy efficiency in their operations and maintenance can typically reduce bills by 5 to 20 percent.

The money saved from lower energy bills can help schools pay for building upgrades that enhance the health and quality of the students' learning environment.

"Investment" = construction and renovation.

https://www.epa.gov/schools-healthy-buildings

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by dilbert firestorm

that's what pretty much what my mother who is a retired teacher told me when dealing with child turds.

... your mom knows! Those who have been on the front line do!

I had a big chuckle years ago when I college "degree" counselor was talking about "Education Psychology" and why students who had it before "a long time ago" had to take it again. She said "we've learned a lot in the past 30 years!"

Yea! Teenage pregnancies, dependencies, and crime HAVE INCREASED!

"Learned a lot," but it ain't working!