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JD Barleycorn · 04-03-2013, 01:10 AM

What EXACTLY happened at Waco? Who fired first? If it was an agent what was his name. Why was there no medical personnel available for a dynamic entry? Why was the property bulldozed so quickly? Not saying that there was a conspiracy but there were a few people who had it their best interests not to have all the evidence out there.

The warrant was issued because of two allegations; child abuse and automatic weapons. They never showed us an automatic weapon (the inside informant who survived withdrew his charge) and since when did child abuse become a capital crime (even though a number of survivors denied any abuse). Without those two things, why was this assault carried out? It would be real embarassing to have to admit that it was a choice to demonstrate something to the public.

LexusLover · 04-03-2013, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnadfly

I'm going with Dominican hookers.

Fixed it.

News last night is suggesting a "disgruntled government official" ....

.. that "news" doesn't fit with earlier reports of a state-wide "hit list" of DA's.

This speculation reminds me of the assistant U.S. attorney shooting in S.A. followed by the killing of Judge Woods .... no connection when it ironed out. .... at least "on paper."

LexusLover · 04-03-2013, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Fixed it.

News last night is suggesting a "disgruntled government official" ....

.. that "news" doesn't fit with earlier reports of a state-wide "hit list" of DA's.

This speculation reminds me of the assistant U.S. attorney shooting in S.A. followed by the killing of Judge Woods .... no connection when it ironed out. .... at least "on paper."

Now HE looks guilty, doesn't he?

Yssup Rider · 04-03-2013, 03:13 PM

we need to regruntle this assholes!

LexusLover · 04-03-2013, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

we need to regruntle this assholes!

It seems he is "not guilty" of the kilings .. at least the DA and his wife. He was "handy"!

timpage · 04-03-2013, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Fixed it.

News last night is suggesting a "disgruntled government official" ....

.. that "news" doesn't fit with earlier reports of a state-wide "hit list" of DA's.

This speculation reminds me of the assistant U.S. attorney shooting in S.A. followed by the killing of Judge Woods .... no connection when it ironed out. .... at least "on paper."

I remember that. They shot that US attorney's car to pieces in Alamo Heights but no hits. Judge Wood was killed by Woody Harrelson's dad right off Broadway....hired by the Chagra brothers.

You a San Antonio boy? Remember Fred Carrasco? Crazy bastard.

Guest032516 · 04-03-2013, 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

What EXACTLY happened at Waco? Who fired first? If it was an agent what was his name. Why was there no medical personnel available for a dynamic entry? Why was the property bulldozed so quickly? Not saying that there was a conspiracy but there were a few people who had it their best interests not to have all the evidence out there.

The warrant was issued because of two allegations; child abuse and automatic weapons. They never showed us an automatic weapon (the inside informant who survived withdrew his charge) and since when did child abuse become a capital crime (even though a number of survivors denied any abuse). Without those two things, why was this assault carried out? It would be real embarassing to have to admit that it was a choice to demonstrate something to the public.

There is no definitive answer about who fired the first shot. Both sides blamed the other.

The ATF did not carry out "an assault" (at least not initially). They executed a search warrant. The warrant was issued to SEARCH for automatic weapons and evidence of child abuse based on probable cause. A warrant doesn't guarantee those things will be found.

But they were never fully able to execute the warrant. The Branch Davidians knew they were coming and armed up beforehand. The gun battle broke out before they even entered the place. However, it turned out the Davidians not only had automatic weapons, several members were convicted for possessing and using machine guns and grenades.

In any event, the Branch Davidians killed four of the ATF agents who were trying to execute the search warrant. The killing of the ATF agents was the capital crime, not the child abuse.

After the initial shootout, the 50-day siege commenced, ultimately ending in the Branch Davidians setting fire to their complex when the ATF used armored vehicles to punch holes in the walls and pump in tear gas.

JD Barleycorn · 04-04-2013, 02:02 AM

I remember the intial video with ATF guys on the roof, wearing body armor, carrying what looked and assault weapon. Some way to serve a warrant. Why didn't they use the local sheriff who testified that he had a rapport with Koresh. Still wonder what happened to the medics. All that fire power and not plan for casualities.

Even Dan Rather has questions that have not been answered. http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-500164_162-153120.html

LexusLover · 04-04-2013, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by timpage

I remember that. They shot that US attorney's car to pieces in Alamo Heights but no hits. Judge Wood was killed by Woody Harrelson's dad right off Broadway....hired by the Chagra brothers.

Jimmy Chagra was acquitted (found not guilty) of hiring Harrelson.

As for Harrelson, who was convicted of doing the killing: no weapon, no witness (except for a hypnotized female lawyer who lived in the same condo complex as the Judge .. but didn't see or hear any shooting, and a taxi driver who changed the description of the person riding in his cab after he had some interviews with the Feds. There was no direct evidence that tied him to the killing. Harrelson had a lengthy history he bragged about, which was his demise ... talking too much (his testimony at the trial was "theater" for him). Someone had to go down for the Judge.

The Assistant U.S. Attorney attempt was never tied to Judge Wood's killing. BTW he was transferred out of the SA office and given a desk job incognito with the DOJ.

My point was, and is. Someone has to go down for the security embarrassment.

LexusLover · 04-04-2013, 02:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Why didn't they use the local sheriff ..

Four words: Janet Reno + Bill Clinton.

JD Barleycorn · 04-04-2013, 02:58 AM

Back to the OP; the FBI has declassified some documents connecting the AB and the Mexican drug cartels. It is no longer racism that motivates it is not money.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...o-AB-Confirmed

Sorry to inform you but Janet Reno was not Attorney General at the time that Waco started. Probably Hillary (and this is not a joke) was running justice herself.

Guest040616 · 04-04-2013, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Probably Hillary (and this is not a joke) was running justice herself.

Link?????

LexusLover · 04-04-2013, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Sorry to inform you but Janet Reno was not Attorney General at the time that Waco started. Probably Hillary (and this is not a joke) was running justice herself.

Sorry to inform you, but you are full of shit (but you already knew that).

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontl...openingst.html

The question posed BY YOU was: "Why didn't they use the local sheriff .." ...

You answer above ("Janet Reno was not Attorney General at the time that Waco started") .... doesn't even resolve your question .... But here's Reno (or do you know more than she did back then?) ....

"When I took office on March the 12th, 1993, the most urgent issue I faced was how to bring the standoff to a safe and peaceful end. Remember why we were in Waco: Four federal agents had been killed trying to arrest Koresh and to seize illegal explosives and illegal weapons, including hand grenades, grenade launchers, and machine guns. We couldn't just walk away from it.
"Day after day, FBI negotiators tried to arrange a surrender. During the standoff, the FBI had 949 conversations with Koresh or his lieutenants, totaling almost 215 hours. At the urging of the FBI, the local sheriff attempted to get Koresh to surrender. So did several lawyers and others who were given extraordinary access to the compound."

LexusLover · 04-04-2013, 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

I remember the intial video with ATF guys on the roof, wearing body armor, carrying what looked and assault weapon. Some way to serve a warrant.

Dumbass! When LE serves a warrant (search or arrest) at a FACILITY in which weapons are suspected (based on probable cause) to exist they will approach and enter with "body armour" and heavier fire power than is suspected inside with more personnel than is suspected inside ... it is called "overwhelming presence" ... and they are going to surprise the occupants ... kicking the doors.

If one doesn't want the doors kicked, and "scary" guys with "body armour" and "mean looking guns" ... tromping about inside then ....

answer the door, invite them inside, and let them look around after they have handed you a copy of the court order that says they can.

What happened is that Federal agents got killed executing a search warrant and a nut-case torched the building with women and kids inside during the final assault to make the arrest. Unfortunately, people get hurt in those circumstances ... in LE activites .. AND WAR!

Whirlaway · 04-04-2013, 06:46 AM

To get this thread back on topic (and not some pissing match over Waco):

FBI DOCUMENTS CONNECT ARYAN BROTHERHOOD WITH MEXICAN CARTELS

As I posted earlier, the Obama administration has reason to lead us into thinking this is homegrown domestic terrorism, when in fact, it may well be a foreign threat due to our unsecured borders.

Don't be surprised if Obama provided (Fast N Furious) weapons are connected to this developing story......

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Governm...o-AB-Confirmed