Rand Paul's filibuster

[Jackie S]

So what is "due proccess".

In many people's opinion, based on the complaints lodged at Police Forces throughout the United States, cops gun down criminals all the time without "due proccess".

[WTF]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Conclusion: This is not about an attack but the preplanning which could be taken care of in a more efficient and safe manner through regular means. .

How so , could you provide more details.

Could it be compared to Iraq. Where we thought we knew they had WMD's and we sent in inspectors. And then we kill them no matter what? Is that the kind of tactics you advocate.

Because make no mistake, that is wtf preemptive means, you kill another based on wtf you think they are going to do. How will that hold up in a court of law?

Rand Paul made much ado about nothing. He was like the person who wanted assurances that you would open the door for your wife but said nothing about you beating the living shit out of her.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Jackie S

So what is "due proccess".

In many people's opinion, based on the complaints lodged at Police Forces throughout the United States, cops gun down criminals all the time without "due proccess".

Due process for these nitwits is the police holing up a suspect and then burning down the house with no arrest or trial.

These bitch's gripe about the government but then want you to submit totally to police harassment or be killed for not doing so. Randy Weaver comes to mind.

[JD Barleycorn]

Wow, I guess Candy Randy's denseness is catching. The CIA has an intelligence mandate for operation OUTSIDE the United States. Note, I said intelligence and not law and order mandate. Why? Because the US doesn't have any law enforcement authority outside the country. INSIDE the United States the CIA has no mandate to do anything. The FBI has a crime and intelligence mandate and working through local agencies have hundreds of thousands of employees.
Now, this only applies to law enforcement; the CIA and by extension the US military have no dog in the hunt. As far as we know, only the military has armed drones. So as a matter of public law you can't have armed drones in the skies of the United States. Unless you don't care about breaking the law. The FBI, which has no drones (as far as we know) but they are charged with tracking threats to the country and people. They also have the authority to enforce the law. They cannot use any means necessary, there are laws that they too have to obey whether we like it or not from time to time.

There two examples being bandied about; the first is about a suspected terrorist becoming involved in the planning or support stages of a future terrorist operation. The second (mentioned here incessantly) is about an active paramilitary terrorist operation. You know, shooting and blowing things up. Two different beasts. Since the CIA has no jurisdiction lets look at how the FBI does their job. They get intelligence through taps, humint, and connecting dots. They follow the suspect and watch them. They don't burst in on a meeting and shoot them all! When they have a case and before anyone is injuried they will make themselves known and ARREST the suspects. They will do it armed with weapons and probably backed up with a tactical team or two but they will arrest them. They don't assassinate them. This is the real discussion. Do we change over two hundred years of law enforcement and strike through sections of the Constitution in our fear?

Wake up Candy Randy! Try to pay attention.

The only thing that Rand Paul wanted was a public statement by the Obama administration that they were not going to change the law and were going to obey the present law. What could be easier? So why was it so hard for the White House to comply? If you walk into a bank and the guard stops you and asks do you promise not to rob the bank? Why can't you say NO and walk in? Why would you hem and haw, try to change the topic, or walk around the question?

As a general aside; killing terrorists with drones is a losing proposition. We should be capturing them for intel if possible. OBL was a strategic failure on a grand scale. He should have been taken alive and questioned. For you historian types imagine capturing Rommel rather than killing him (as we almost did). Any operation that he was involved in would have to be changed or cancelled and he was involved in the defense of France! Whether OBL talked or not, whether he died or not, the Taliban would have to change their operations just in case. Face it, Obama is a poor general like *snick* Hitler was.

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WTF

Stupid SOB (that would be directed at you, exNYer) forgets that Presidents argue about what the definition of 'is', is!

Now go suck Rand Paul's dick for pointing out that a windshield better not take on an elephant but can crush a bug.

Do you even have a point, shit-for-brains? (I'm sure I don't have to tell you that is directed at you. You've been hearing it your whole life.)

The phrase "very soon will be" isn't controversial. There is a whole body of law around the meaning of "imminent danger". It means the bad guy is taking aim to shoot you or something equally unmistakeable. You don't have to wait for him to actually fire before you shoot. Those situations are well defined in the law and Presidents don't get to pick their own definition of "combat" or "imminent danger".

That includes your heroes Clinton and Obama.

I applaud Rand Paul for demanding a straight answer to a simple question. Obama/Holder tried to get cute with qualifiers about not killing Americans "not engaged in terrorism".

Rand made them be more specific - "not engaged in combat".

And forget about the "drone" red herring. I don't care if they are using rifles and handguns instead.

I don't want cops/FBI kicking in doors and opening fire on everybody in the place and then saying "they were engaged in terrorism" based on Al-Qeada recruiting documents they find inside. Or large bags of cash and fake IDs.

The cops involved in the Dorner manhunt in California opened fire on a car with two innocent middle aged women in it. They put about 15-20 bullets into it. Fortunately neither woman was seriously injured.

There are too many cowboy cops/LE - including at the federal level. The shit that was done to Jose Padilla - an American citizen - was an outrage. Due process isn't optional for the chief executive.

And you seem to be OK with that because you don't want to give any credit to Rand Paul.

[JD Barleycorn]

Good response X, I tend to go for the historical example and be a little wordy. Yes, imminent danger is the key or the definition for imminent. Ask any cop can I shoot the asshole (not you Whatzup) next door is he threatens me? The answer is NO. You can report him for assault or if he displays a weapon or uses the threat of a weapon then he is guilty of aggravated assault but you still can't shoot him. If he enters your property, brandishes a weapon, and now promises to kill you then things change. Depending on how far you can let him hang himself you have a better chance of escaping any legal punishment. The law in some states, like Missouri, allows for you to kill an intruder irregardless of their stated intent. The so-called "Castle law". What Rand wanted was a promise by the White House to not throw a grenade in the bathroom window when the other person was on the toliet.

[CJohnny54]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Been gone for a few days but nothing has changed. Stupid, useless remarks from Whatzup, deflections from Timmy, and a few gay remarks thrown in for good measure.

The only two things worth responding to are WTF: he was called Underdog (your little theme)

Timmy; no one is talking about a terrorist ATTACK. If you had listened to the debate or read about it from a neutral source it is about an alleged terrorist planning, supplying, or otherwise supporting a FUTURE terrorist attack in public and being killed on orders from the White House. That killing could be by drone, manned plane, or elite commandos. It would be a killing without due process of an American on American soil by the wishes of one man without appeal. It has nothing to do with an attack. Now, if your hypothetical attack did occur then all bets are off. I like to think that both law enforcement and civilians will rally to the defense of the country.

Conclusion: This is not about an attack but the preplanning which could be taken care of in a more efficient and safe manner through regular means. (Don't let the ATF be involved, they screwed up WACO big time)*

*Not that I agree with what they did at WACO but their tactics and preparation sucked.

Originally Posted by The2Dogs

The village idiots, McCain and Graham, sure went into panic mode and shit their nests. It is way past time to rid the village of the idiots.

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

I suppose YOU are the one qualified to tell us what this thread is about, or even try to moderate it. Your simplistic views denigrate the very premise of the thread... Rand Paul's 13-hour Hand Solo...

Reading your conclusion only reveals a cracked foundation and slipshod construction.

You got nothing!

+ CODE ... Timmy stand for cousin Tim

+ Listening to my private conversation in my own home, car, and phone w/o cause. Government unreasonable search of my vehicle. STEALING of my ideal. STEALING my ideal for political gain and profit from my ideal. Dxuging me to erase my memory, so they can STEAL my ideal w/o me remembering. Dxuging me to cause Heart Attack... one dxug mix with certain food preservative from McD cause Extreme constipated. (Oh I think this is called attempted murder)

[Sidewinder]

Originally Posted by Chica Chaser

After 12 hours he probably had to piss.
He brought attention to the matter, which was his goal. Even CNN/MSNBC had to cover the story so lots of people saw something that never would have heard about it otherwise. Mission accomplished.

Catheters, including condom catheters, and collection bags are well-known technology. There is reason to believe that these have been used in at least one Senate filibuster. (I don't remember the details, it was many years ago.)

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by Sidewinder

Catheters, including condom catheters, and collection bags are well-known technology. There is reason to believe that these have been used in at least one Senate filibuster. (I don't remember the details, it was many years ago.)

I think Burt Reynolds wore one of those in a movie. It was VERY long ago, so I may be getting the exact details wrong, but...

His character was attending some kind of intense rehab or religious meeting where none of the attendees was allowed to leave while they were being brainwashed or preached at.

Prior to the meeting, you see Reynolds buying a metal flask-like container that can be strapped to the ankle and some rubber hose.

After some hours, others in the meeting are breaking down, crying and wetting themselves. Then you hear the sound of water splattering on metal and see Reynolds' character - sitting in a back row looking nice and relaxed - with a big smile on his face.

[WTF]

North Dallas Forty, you nitwit from New Yark City

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WTF

North Dallas Forty, you nitwit from New Yark City

If you are going to call someone a "nitwit from New York City", try to get the spelling right.

Shit-for-brains. Now and forever.

[WTF]

I spelt it the way you dipshits pronounce it

[WTF]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

.

I applaud Rand Paul for demanding a straight answer to a simple question. Obama/Holder tried to get cute with qualifiers about not killing Americans "not engaged in terrorism".

Rand made them be more specific - "not engaged in combat".

Rand Paul should make sure we aren't going to drone Tinker Bell while he is at it.

It was a PR move done for folks that leave the night light on.

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WTF

I spelt it the way you dipshits pronounce it

NOBODY pronounces it "Yark", shit-for-brains.

I've heard it pronounced "Yawk" by some, but I have never heard it pronounced "Yark".

[CJohnny54]

Stop trying to get my attention every fuxking storm.
JD knows fuxking giant lizard, like I said not me.
Climate change or some shit or spying on me in the restroom... my room. (Oh that day you had someone come to check on my niece... FUXKING SPY PERVERT....)
Oh yeah, the copy of my car key where you constantly brake into (illegal). So, if their is ever any contra band in my Vehicle YOU KNOW WHO PLACE IT THERE!

AT THE BEGINNING ...AFTER USING THE RADIO STATION TO PLAY YOUR GAME...CALLING AND TREATING WATER BOARDING WHEN I WAS AT THE UH LIBRARY STUDYING



TO BE CONTINUE