Trump and the anthem

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by derek303

Google Rick Monday saves the flag. Now that's a great sports moment. 2 hippy punks (liberals) ran onto the field and were trying to set the flag they carried with them on fire. They poured lighter fluid on it and was lighting a match and Monday who was playing Center field rushed in and scooped it up. The crowd ended up all standing and sang "God bless America." Would you liberals on here stood and sang as well? Or would you of cheered on the flag burners? This all happened in 1976.

Yes I would have sung. Burning the flag is much different than taking a knee in my opinion. The people like Kaepenick love this country but also believe there are injustices that exist and are protesting against them. Right message, possibly wrong venue for getting that message across.

[pussycat]

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

Yes I would have sung. Burning the flag is much different than taking a knee in my opinion. The people like Kaepenick love this country but also believe there are injustices that exist and are protesting against them. Right message, possibly wrong venue for getting that message across.

It started with Kaepenick seeking to make a statement against unarmed blacks being killed by police. Not a bad motive but it disrespected the country as a whole rather than police. His idea was that the whole country is against the black man, and that's not a message Joe sixpack sports fan wants to hear. Trump jumped on it because he knew that most sports fans would support his "patriotic" outrage, and he was right. Now the billionaire team owners are torn between catering to their players and their audiences. Score another one for Trump.

[FLReWrite]

Originally Posted by derek303

Google Rick Monday saves the flag. Now that's a great sports moment. 2 hippy punks (liberals) ran onto the field and were trying to set the flag they carried with them on fire. They poured lighter fluid on it and was lighting a match and Monday who was playing Center field rushed in and scooped it up. The crowd ended up all standing and sang "God bless America." Would you liberals on here stood and sang as well? Or would you of cheered on the flag burners? This all happened in 1976.

Thank you for this. I had forgotten all about it.

[Sirgenerous]

Originally Posted by zerodark13

“Those Americans who today think patriotism means unquestioning obedience and mandatory respect to a flag...would, 240 years ago, have thought the same about a King.” - Jim Wright

Jim’s a veteran, as am I. Kneeling is a sign of respect, and has been for centuries; conservatives and alt-right pussies (who have mostly never heard a shot fired in anger, and would shit their pants if they did) aren’t mad about the kneeling, let’s be honest; they’re mad at mostly non-white groups who defy their notions of propriety. They see that white male supremacy is dying out, and it scares the fuck out of them. Too fucking bad. Stock up on kleenex and lube; the world is changing, and you can either get on the right side of history, or get run the fuck over by that change.

+1

Thank you sir!

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by pussycat

It started with Kaepenick seeking to make a statement against unarmed blacks being killed by police. Not a bad motive but it disrespected the country as a whole rather than police. His idea was that the whole country is against the black man, and that's not a message Joe sixpack sports fan wants to hear. Trump jumped on it because he knew that most sports fans would support his "patriotic" outrage, and he was right. Now the billionaire team owners are torn between catering to their players and their audiences. Score another one for Trump.

Trump was not right. Far from it. Attendance at NFL games did not go down last weekend. Don't know yet about tv viewing. Before Trump commented/tweeted on the protests, a handful, maybe 2 or 3, NFL players were protesting. After calling them SOBs and coming down hard on them, the show of support for the protesters by other players was incredible in my opinion.

All Trump did was bring attention to the protesters and now most people understand why they are taking a knee. There was little to no focus on them before. Now there is. I doubt that is what Trump's goal was. Fans care about a football game. The minute or so before the game when the national anthem is played is a time of anticipation for the fans, which is why they start cheering about 10 seconds before it ends. Get it over and let's play ball.

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

Trump was not right. Far from it. Attendance at NFL games did not go down last weekend. Don't know yet about tv viewing. Before Trump commented/tweeted on the protests, a handful, maybe 2 or 3, NFL players were protesting. After calling them SOBs and coming down hard on them, the show of support for the protesters by other players was incredible in my opinion.

All Trump did was bring attention to the protesters and now most people understand why they are taking a knee. There was little to no focus on them before. Now there is. I doubt that is what Trump's goal was. Fans care about a football game. The minute or so before the game when the national anthem is played is a time of anticipation for the fans, which is why they start cheering about 10 seconds before it ends. Get it over and let's play ball.

The more salient observation was that the fans booed again when the players took a knee before the anthem and stood for it. So they weren’t disrespecting the anthem or the soldiers but people still weren’t happy? Maybe people just don’t want to see African Americans fight for equality. They would much rather see them be their entertainment and not a human being.

[Austin Ellen]

I'm standing with him.

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

I'm standing with him.

And I ask you, if this is all about the flag and the anthem. Why are people booing when people take a knee before the anthem to protest the social injustices and stand during the anthem?

And while you stand with him, plenty of veterans have come out and stand they kneel with the players so why can't you honor their viewpoints? Did they not serve the country too? Do they not get to voice what they dedicated their service to? Y'all refuse to listen to why the players are kneeling and what they are protesting. Instead you've created a narrative of players being anti-anthem and vets when they've said they aren't. And you still refuse to give the issue of social injustice the same outrage you've dedicated to the fake narrative you've created.

Oh and the obvious pandering that this administration does. He went to a football game, knowing that their would be some form protest because in interviews players on the team said they would continue protesting. He goes to the game and is outraged and decides to leave. Even though his plans show that he going to be in another state during the time the game would still be going on. And they told the press to stay in their vans because there may be an early departure. Yeah his plan the whole time was to walk and in disgust. How cute.

[zerodark13]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

I'm standing with him.

If he knew you, Pence would tell you that you’re going to Hell, not even for being a provider, but because he thinks that all women are sinners just because they have naughty parts. He won’t even allow himself to be in a room alone with a woman (any woman) unless his wife is present. That you “stand with him” is more of a testament to you not standing for yourself and worshiping hypocrites than anything else.

[Austin Ellen]

Ok hold up - I do have outrage for social injustice. I just do not agree with doing it the way the players are doing it.
I think promoting education and community based outreach programs are better. Supporting things like body cameras so everything can be recorded so we don't have have cops lying anymore. As you have said in the past - I'm old - I grew up with respect for the military and the flag. I'm not gonna change now.

Originally Posted by Austin Dude

And I ask you, if this is all about the flag and the anthem. Why are people booing when people take a knee before the anthem to protest the social injustices and stand during the anthem?

And while you stand with him, plenty of veterans have come out and stand they kneel with the players so why can't you honor their viewpoints? Did they not serve the country too? Do they not get to voice what they dedicated their service to? Y'all refuse to listen to why the players are kneeling and what they are protesting. Instead you've created a narrative of players being anti-anthem and vets when they've said they aren't. And you still refuse to give the issue of social injustice the same outrage you've dedicated to the fake narrative you've created.

Oh and the obvious pandering that this administration does. He went to a football game, knowing that their would be some form protest because in interviews players on the team said they would continue protesting. He goes to the game and is outraged and decides to leave. Even though his plans show that he going to be in another state during the time the game would still be going on. And they told the press to stay in their vans because there may be an early departure. Yeah his plan the whole time was to walk and in disgust. How cute.

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

Ok hold up - I do have outrage for social injustice. I just do not agree with doing it the way the players are doing it.
I think promoting education and community based outreach programs are better. Supporting things like body cameras so everything can be recorded so we don't have have cops lying anymore. As you have said in the past - I'm old - I grew up with respect for the military and the flag. I'm not gonna change now.

You know people didn’t agree with the marches of King or the bus boycott. Doesn’t mean that they weren’t right or that those people weren’t wrong. Again those things like education are promoted but the issues still need to be exposed and a lot of people don’t believe they exist. And body cams don’t do anything. I saw a man killed on FB Live and the cop got off. Those don’t matter. I think the biggest issue here is that the players and people like me have more to lose and are more directly effected by the issue so we beat the drum trying to tell people it’s an issue. People don’t listen so players protest. And then the issue becomes the protest. Guess what people respect the military, it’s not an older person thing. But people also want to enjoy the same freedoms others have. The freedom that their family have also fought and died for. If you can’t agree with the way they are doing it, that’s on you but it’s still something others don’t mind.

[gfejunkie]

Looks like the tide is beginning to turn...

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...wont-play.html

Makes sense. The NFL knows which side it's bread is buttered on...

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/sh...rticle/2636837

[Observing]

Originally Posted by gfejunkie

Looks like the tide is beginning to turn...

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...wont-play.html

Makes sense. The NFL knows which side it's bread is buttered on.

Even the Conservative Right-Wing press can see through this bullshit.
"This was nothing more than a stunt. A premeditated and incredibly cynical stunt. I was going to call it a “cheap stunt” — but that would be wildly inaccurate, because it actually cost the taxpayers quite a lot of money. Consider: Pence had just been in Las Vegas, and his next stop was Los Angeles, a short plane flight west — but he instead flew all the back to Indianapolis for this photo op, taking his entourage and his security detail with him. The streets doubtless had to be blocked off for his motorcade. I’m quite sure special security precautions were taken for the Vice President of the United States. And all along, he planned to engage in a tawdry, pre-planned sham performance — with all the expense that entails — just to get people embroiled in a cynical culture war."
Also...
"Forget for a moment that this is a vice president who fronts for a Commander-in-Chief that mocked a POW and insulted the family of a slain solider, yet blathers about “disrespect.” Forget that he just used “soldiers, Flag, and National Anthem” for his own form of protest (irony!). Forget even his bizarre capitalization of “Flag.” It’s not what happened. It’s how it happened. This was staged: a taxpayer subsidized stunt aimed at attacking dissenting black athletes. It was revealed in record time to be yet another toxic effort by this administration to divide people along racial lines and distract us from a train wreck of an administration, described by Senator Bob Corker as “an adult day care center” that looks after a big orange baby."
https://www.thenation.com/article/mi...sparent-stunt/
And...
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewir...-on-colts-game
This fucking guy always gives up the game. Pence trying to play it off like it wasn't a staged event, and then Trump just blurts out on twitter he told him to do it.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by gfejunkie

Looks like the tide is beginning to turn...

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...wont-play.html

Makes sense. The NFL knows which side it's bread is buttered on...

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/sh...rticle/2636837

Let's review the games that were on TV yesterday:

At Dallas -- 100% full
At Philadelphia -100% full
At Houston -- 100% full
At NY -- 94% full

Yup. Trump's comments really seem to be hurting attendance. And Jerry Jones certainly has the right to do whatever he wants to do with protesting players.

[gfejunkie]

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

Let's review the games that were on TV yesterday:

At Dallas -- 100% full
At Philadelphia -100% full
At Houston -- 100% full
At NY -- 94% full

Yup. Trump's comments really seem to be hurting attendance. And Jerry Jones certainly has the right to do whatever he wants to do with protesting players.

Good thing the NFL has more foresight than you do. Maybe they'll survive.