OBAMACARE ARCHITECT: OF COURSE WE LIED TO GET THE THING PASSED !

[flghtr65]

Originally Posted by Budman

Remember the Pelosi quote that we needed to pass the bill to find out what is in it? You are correct that many in congress are lawyers and should be able to read and understand the bill. The republicans all understood that is was all lies. Smoke and mirrors. The fucking dems either are to stupid to realize it was lies or are complicit in the deception.

You are probably correct in that it will only benefit 20% of the population but it will have an impact on every one of us. Employer provided insurance is being changed. Employees are having to pay more for their insurance. Hours are being cut to avoid having to offer insurance to employees.

One objective of the ACA is that people with pre-existing conditions will not be denied health insurance coverage in the free market. Therefore, high risk people are included in the risk pools of the individual market, this drives up the cost for the insurance company to insure these high risk people. In the past the high risk people were denied a health insurance policy. These people were forced into the states high risk program, 1. if they could afford it and 2. if the state had a high risk program. Not all states had a high risk program and some you had to remain uninsured for 6 months before you could apply to the high risk program. The individual market before the ACA had a lot of problems and resulted in millions of people being uninsured.

[Budman]

Originally Posted by WTF

Will do but let's make it 40 years!....we can add up how much pay for our wounded's long term health care has cost.


WASHINGTON, Mar 30 2013 (IPS) - Costs to U.S. taxpayers of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan will run between four and six trillion dollars, making them the most expensive conflicts in U.S. history, according to a new report by a prominent Harvard University researcher....

...
After researching federal records, it reported last week that compensation for World War II veterans and their families only reached a high in 1991 – 46 years after the war ended.
It also reported that, almost exactly 40 years after the last U.S. combat troops left Vietnam, the government is still paying veterans and their families or survivors more than 22 billion dollars a year in war-related claims, and that that figure is on the rise, as the beneficiary population ages. Similarly, payments to Gulf War veterans are also increasing.
The much-greater costs to be incurred by the Iraq and Afghanistan wars are explained by, among other factors, much higher survival rates among wounded soldiers, more generous benefits for veterans, new categories of beneficiaries, more expensive medical treatments, and increases in both pay and benefits for troops in order to gain more recruits for the all-volunteer army. http://www.ipsnews.net/2013/03/iraq-...ollars-report/




Oh Bush lied....whether he did it on purpose or not is another verse but there is no doubt he lied because we did not find what we were told we would find.

Hypocrite? ...do you think Obamacare will kill 4,400 US Soldiers?....have more than 253,000 troops suffered a traumatic brain injury.

I am not even counting all the innocent live that the nation of Iraq lost.




Yes , I use to self insure. I paid out of pocket for any medical costs. Now I pay 500 bucks a month to Cigna. I'm not the majority of Americans.

For some stupid reason you continually want to change the topic of this thread to Bush and the war in Iraq. That is not what this thread is about. That topic has been argued to death and nobody that I'm aware of has changed their mind.

The topic here is it OK for the administration to lie to get a bill passed? Your definition of lies is very different than most. I don't believe that someone is lying if they truly believe that what they are saying is true. You apparently believe that no matter what the research shows and what the general belief is that everyone is lying. Using your silly logic if you tell your wife goodbye in the morning and say "see you this evening" but you get killed in a car accident then you are a fucking liar. Pretty harsh definition. This administration has admitted lying and deceiving the American people for the purpose of passing this law. It is the typical liberal attitude of "do as I say not as I do". The libs think they know what is best for you and you are just to stupid to realize it.

[Budman]

Originally Posted by flghtr65

One objective of the ACA is that people with pre-existing conditions will not be denied health insurance coverage in the free market. Therefore, high risk people are included in the risk pools of the individual market, this drives up the cost for the insurance company to insure these high risk people. In the past the high risk people were denied a health insurance policy. These people were forced into the states high risk program, 1. if they could afford it and 2. if the state had a high risk program. Not all states had a high risk program and some you had to remain uninsured for 6 months before you could apply to the high risk program. The individual market before the ACA had a lot of problems and resulted in millions of people being uninsured.

What's your point? Regardless of the objective they lied thru their fucking teeth about this law. You can spin this all you want but that won't change the facts. So based on your post it is OK to punish 80% of the public to benefit 20%.

[Budman]

Originally Posted by WTF

You do understand that employees should have been paying tax on the insurance their employee provided as it is really nothing more than a wage. Self employed people have had to...

I'm not arguing that Obamacare is good, in fact it needs to be overhauled. The fucking GOP needs to get on board and actually offer up something besides REPEAL.

Again you want to change the premise of this thread to somehow make it OK that they lied to get the bill passed. The fact that employer provided health insurance was not taxable is another argument all together. Start a thread on that and we may find some common ground but this thread is about the administration lying and you and your ilk defending that.

[Yssup Rider]

Talk to yourself much, budman?

[gfejunkie]

Originally Posted by Budman

For some stupid reason you continually want to change the topic of this thread to Bush and the war in Iraq. That is not what this thread is about. That topic has been argued to death and nobody that I'm aware of has changed their mind.

It's called...



A well known liberal tactic. It should be called every time it's used.
In his case... every other post.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Budman

Again you want to change the premise of this thread to somehow make it OK that they lied to get the bill passed. The fact that employer provided health insurance was not taxable is another argument all together. Start a thread on that and we may find some common ground but this thread is about the administration lying and you and your ilk defending that.

All I am doing is showing your hypocrisy. You do not mind being lied to about WMD and blowing 4-6 TRILLION dollars with 4,400+ Soldiers deaths and hundred of thousands soldiers wounded but you are shitting your pants about being lied to help insure your fellow citizens which will save many , many lives in the process!

So when you only cry about one Party lying and you overlook the other party lying, I have no sympathy nor respect for that line of thinking. You want to hold one accountable and make excuses for the other. Two can play that game and that is all the fuck I am doing.

[Whirlaway]

From 11 months ago On Keystone:

State Department releases Keystone XL final environmental impact statement

The State Department concluded in its final environmental assessment issued Friday that the proposed Keystone XL pipeline would be unlikely to alter global greenhouse gas emissions, but officials cautioned that they are still weighing whether the project would meet the test of President Obama’s broader climate strategy.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/busine...ba3_story.html

[Whirlaway]

wrong thread....

[Yssup Rider]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

wrong thread....

Every thread in which you post is the WRONG THREAD!

LMAO!

[Budman]

Originally Posted by WTF

All I am doing is showing your hypocrisy. You do not mind being lied to about WMD and blowing 4-6 TRILLION dollars with 4,400+ Soldiers deaths and hundred of thousands soldiers wounded but you are shitting your pants about being lied to help insure your fellow citizens which will save many , many lives in the process!

So when you only cry about one Party lying and you overlook the other party lying, I have no sympathy nor respect for that line of thinking. You want to hold one accountable and make excuses for the other. Two can play that game and that is all the fuck I am doing.

You are not showing anything. I don't believe Bush lied. Just about every intelligence agency in the world agreed with Bush. Just about every democrat in congress agreed with Bush. Get off of this BS that it is anywhere close to the same. You and your kind a so far up Obama's ass that you will defend him regardless of what he does. Jesus fucking Christ dude try and follow along. This thread is about whether or not it is OK for the administration to lie the American people just to get a bill passed. They have admitted doing this and you apparently believe it is OK. You hypocrisy is unbelievable.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Budman

You are not showing anything. I don't believe Bush lied. Just about every intelligence agency in the world agreed with Bush. Just about every democrat in congress agreed with Bush. .

Yes he lied....there were no WMD's like we were told we would find.

I have no sympathy for any of you crybabies whining about this Healthcare lie that excuse Bush's lie. That administration linked Saddam to 9/11 too. Which was really the deceitful lie.

btw...If you need a court to tell you a tax is a tax then you are beyond help.

[Budman]

Originally Posted by WTF

Yes he lied....there were no WMD's like we were told we would find.

I have no sympathy for any of you crybabies whining about this Healthcare lie that excuse Bush's lie. That administration linked Saddam to 9/11 too. Which was really the deceitful lie.

btw...If you need a court to tell you a tax is a tax then you are beyond help.

Wrong again. There were WMD's found in Iraq. They may have been old and of not much use but they were there. Maybe not in the quantity and quality that was expected but some were found. So go back to swallowing Obama's dick. Fucking hypocrite.

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

Snick. Who calls a liar a liar and then lies about his lies?

LMAO

Hahahahaha.................... ... Face it Obamacare is a farce. You fell for it, so sad. Even the creator of Obamacare said ya got duped.


Jim

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Budman

Wrong again. There were WMD's found in Iraq. They may have been old and of not much use but they were there. Maybe not in the quantity and quality that was expected but some were found. .

That was not what we went in there looking for....we knew they had old shit....we sold it to them!

God Damn, that would be like raiding a Toys R Us Store for real weapons and finding nothing but toy guns! Fucking knew that going in. That was not the justification for going in. .