Some Perspective From A Retired Pro -

[Guest061511-2]

I have a headache now, but this has been a very imformative and useful thread! A lot to think about hmmm. I've always offered grandfathered rates to most previous clients. I usually offer a hh free when booking an hr session too. I really only advertise in 3 different places, but I think that will have to change to keep up with business. I have thought about changing my business model a bit, and this gives me great input. Thanks everyone.

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

Yes, his response was about "being called out", however, I'll say it again and again.. He need not respond in such a fashion. And yes, I do believe I am staying on topic! Thanks.

Oy.. just when you think things are going in the right direction. You guys have a great day! It's nice out.. I'm going to have lunch with an old friend.

Excuse me Karma.....

But kitty is not a newbie around here and knows exactly what he is doing when he posts and names a specific name.....

Remember that old "Warriors" movie about gangs in New York?

"Warriors...... Come out and Play".... was a repeated line at one point.....

Well....

You don't have to stand in front of a mirror and say "Whispers" 3 times to get a response from me.....

You have no idea how many people will email me or PM me when someone like kittylover invokes my name to get a response....

As to threads staying on topic....

My response in this thread was on topic..... Kitty took it off and his comments required a response.....

Here you are talking not about the original subject matter but about my response to kitty lover......


and speaking on staying on subject matter what is your purpose of this post?

Originally Posted by karmanmia

Originally Posted by kittyloveratx
I will ask you once politely to stop threatening, demeaning, belittling, and discouraging anyone that posts a response you don't agree with. This has been an honest and eye-opening thread for all of us here as it was intended. There is no reason at all for you to constantly bash every person that doesn't follow your directives implicitly. Not everyone is a lamb who will fall in stride with the rest of the sheeple.
Some of us have our own opinions as you do and I ASK one last time that you allow everyone to be heard without fear of being attacked by you.

**PEOPLE, take back your board. Let YOUR perspective be heard. Don't fear the meanies and bullies. They're INTERNET BULLIES for fuck's sake....lol. Why in the world would you fear them and remain silent??**

I did not "threaten" anyone..... but your "I will ask you one politely"... can be construed as such..... you'll ask me once politely or what Karma? ..... Sounds like Internet Bully thing you were mentioning...... You are well known to fabricate lies about people... Noone has quite the rep you do behind the scenes for being so controversial on your side of the fence... From the Ghetto intcall you were charging ladies to use, your attempts to cause dissent amongst the staff of some agencies to the stories you tell...... Welcome to the age of information less censorship......

And your subsequent call to arms for people to take back their board?

What the hell does that have to do with YOUR original subject?

At least you put it in pink which is the color it deserves..... Seems to me that statement alone is a rallying cry to cause some sort of board war..... Sorry Darlin...... your side lost that one..... But that kind of attitude shows you just as guilty as other's in making some of this an "US AGAINST THEM" thing......

I'm not stopping anyone from being heard...... This thread will get a lot of views...... EVERYONE posting here will get heard......

However.... I WILL post my opinions on the subject and I WILL ALWAYS RESPOND when specifically addressed on a subject....

Come on Karma... You know I have to......I have a responsibility to my fan club to do so!



And now I return you to your regularly scheduled "Poor Pitiful Us" show.... If the show proves to be boring please do not be concerned... Just stay tuned for your next commercial break......

On the subject of the original post.... It is kinda cool that you are speaking up for the ladies..... It's kinda surprising they would want you delivering this particular plea for help considering the past and your no longer being active in the biz..... But if you are the Spokes Person for this particular subject for the local ladies it does make one shake their head a little and wondar... What must they have been thinking?......

[Guest092710]

"I did not "threaten" anyone..... but your "I will ask you one politely"... can be construed as such..... you'll ask me once politely or what Karma? ..... Sounds like Internet Bully thing you were mentioning...... You are well known to fabricate lies about people... Noone has quite the rep you do behind the scenes for being so controversial on your side of the fence... From the Ghetto intcall you were charging ladies to use, your attempts to cause dissent amongst the staff of some agencies to the stories you tell...... Welcome to the age of information less censorship......"


So now you'll resort to getting really petty and nasty with me by repeating whatever gossip you've managed to amass? You never stop old man. But, someday you'll find that you can't hide behind your keyboard forever. In any case, I'm not here to be abused by you or anyone else.

That's about all the words I'll waste on you.

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

........ But, someday you'll find that you can't hide behind your keyboard forever.


Now THAT I take as a direct threat.....

That's about all the words I'll waste on you.

I really don't hide much... I do lunches, dinners have drinks with folks and attend parties that hundreds of folks around here have been at as well....

I do like your choice of the word "amass"...... Whenever these little things ensue I become like an information clearing house where your fans as well as those that dislike you PM or email me everything they know or want said that they are too timid to say on their own...... Yeah.... a lot of that crap circulates and lands somewhere......


"amass"..... Yeah... I like that.....

[rekcaSxT]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

I've been around a few years now, made a few friends, but most of all I've never let myself get out of touch with how things are for my compatriots.

How things are is this... The women who have worked so hard to get verified, maintain reputations, maintain fantastic bodies and levels of service for YOU, are STARVING!! Most are entirely too prideful to ever let anyone know this, but being retired allows me much time to read the Powderroom and other backchannels. And fellas, it aint good.

Every day they have to put on that brave face and hope their phones ring. Every day they have to get on here and post ads, and threADs... every day they are bombarded with a huge amount of men spending their money on women that rob them, bait and switch em, lie about levels of service/upsell, have pimps/managers who beat your asses, ..you get the point. Every day, they comfort you when these things happen to you and hope you'll come back to what you know is a good thing. But you don't. EVERY day.. they watch it all go by and wonder why did I work so hard to establish myself only to starve and watch unverified assholes collect money for nothing. Merely because they are "fresh meat".

In the end, what's the point of having this review board and making the women jump through so many hoops only to have a nice smack in the face every day when their phones aren't ringing?!?


The point of my rant/ramble/PSA is that you guys have got to realize that the providers you claim to love so much are not making ends meet. WHY????? Why are you shitting on them by constantly wasting your money elsewhere then coming back here to whine about how horrible it was? What makes you stop caring about the women who have worked so hard to earn their stripes? What makes you stop supporting them?

What do they have to do to get your CONSISTENT business back??? Please, let that be the topic of this discussion. Because really guys, it's so bad that I spend most of my time (as a retired social worker as well) giving referrals to food banks, churches that will help with rent/utilities, and other resources that sustain daily life. So please, answer that very important question. WHAT CAN THE ESTABLISHED VERIFIED PROVIDERS DO TO EARN YOUR CONSISTENT BUSINESS?????

Thanks!

The answer is quite simple, and in fact it is a theme repeated throughout this thread. LOWER Rates.

The reality is that providers are hurting, well guess what? So are many hobbyists. I know that rates are caught up in self worth, but the value of the almighty dollar just isn't what it used to be.

Originally Posted by Absolutely

To each his own...
I dont think anything is consistent in life, the hobby or even marriage
People get bored & people move on.
When I have trouble making ends meet I get a JOB in the real world I may not make as much but I MAKE it!
I can't expect to be 40yo or 50yo and maintain my stamina/health some gents prefer the variety while others choose the same lady..... again to each his own!
I wont take sides but people change folks!
XOXO Dixie Belle

A job in the REAL world, amen. You know a lot of the "ladies" here for whom business is not good, should do that very thing, get a real job. (and pay taxes like we do)

Originally Posted by karmanmia

Way to show some solidarity. Did it ever occur to you that some of these women aren't as fortunate as you and can't just go get a JOB? How bout if you have nothing worthwhile to contribute, go back to the spot ya just came from.

Once again.. I ask this in all seriousness.. What can the tried and true verified providers do to get and keep your business?

Can you tell us why a provider can not go get a real job? We are always being told by you and others like you that providers are women, real women with feelings. So if providers are real women, why can't they get a real job?

(For the record I am not saying that I disrespect any women, but I do want to point out the lunacy in the argument.)

Originally Posted by Taurus99

I usually stay loyal to those who are good to me, but REB is right in that most guys have a SO for long term. Part of the fun of hobbying is variety.

Agreed, and no man should feel guilted into not enjoying that variety, guilt is what an SO is for.

Originally Posted by blenderhead

OK, I'll tell you what pisses me off about some tried and true verified providers.

Improve TCB. Make us feel special. If I send you a appointment request with a specific date and time, don't just reply with a one-liner like "I'd love to see you baby". Put just a little more effort into it. Not much, just a little.

If something comes up and I have to cancel, and I do so several days before the appointment, reply saying that's too bad and hope we can meet soon instead of just blowing me off. I almost never cancel, but had to cancel with two providers recently because I got a bad cold. One of them was known for being sweet and having great TCB. Both of the providers replied with one-line sentences and both blew me off after I had to cancel. Will I try to book again? I doubt it.

If I email you after an appointment and said I had a good time and hope to see you again soon, reply in kind instead of blowing me off.

A lot of very well reviewed ladies here need to learn some basic customer service skills, because if you truly are hurting for business you should have the time to show some interest in clients that are interested in seeing you.

I've actually had better TCB from some providers that are known for being flaky than the "tried and true" providers.

Lack of business sense is a big thing. I have similar issues at work. I hate when my vendors at work only come by when they need a favor of an order. If they don't want to take care of their account the other 3 weeks of the month, then fuck 'em.

I hate getting unsolicited texts or emails from providers I have only seen once. There are very few I have seen more than once. I love that variety.

And the canceling thing goes both ways. Don't cancel on me because someone else didn't take the discount. If you have a confirmed appointment, make it.

Originally Posted by Whispers

Most of us are not so fortunate as to be able to make $250 to $300 an hour doing something we enjoy so much.

Why is it it OUR problem that ladies that made $100k plus tax free last year can't make ends meet this year?

We work hard for our money as well as the ability to afford what is to US a Hobby and are experiencing the same thing.

I work in a certain segment of the market where the Govt just cut what they pay me for my services by 40% just 2 weeks ago. I don't whine about it. 3 of the guys that work for me said "Oh My God what do we do? What do we do?" I pointed out that we live on less or we work harder and more hours. So I need to work more, seek out new sources of revenue and work harder to attract new clientele.

You ask "What can the tried and true verified providers do to get and keep your business?"

I would suggest they do what many of us do at the moment.

Swallow their pride and lower their rates. You want to earn more local business get into the $180-$220 an hour range, provide great TCB and APPRECIATE what you are getting. Undercut the newest Flavor of the Week and take advantage of what she is not able to do, provide the TCB and "I'll see you Now!" service some want.

And by all means don't whine about it here on the boards..... 95% of the ladies here make more per hour than we do.

It is hard to show sympathy for that.

Times have changed darlin.

Luckily for us what is going on in the economy is driving more competition into your segment of the work force.

Younger, Prettier ladies are working for less.





One thing guys are doing lately that you might not be hearing about publicly but I'll say it here..... A lot of us are compromising on TCB for a ride on a wild young hot body at a great rate.

Will she be around next month? No one is really caring.

They are getting line, waiting their turn and having fun.

Lots of good stuff here, and I agree.

Originally Posted by flinde

Amen to that, 78704.

Its not just rates. Its supply/demand - more providers/more providers visiting but guy pool the same or smaller.

Unemployment rate, competition for jobs pushing more providers into the business.

Look at Dallas. They have had an oversupply forever. And what do you see? Good TCB, great prices, expanded service menus.

In SA the Great Recession hasn't hit as hard as lots of places. So what do we see? providers from Phoenix, or Clarke County, or northern and central California area codes coming to visit. Lots of them. All the time.

Many providers have adapted. Putting in more time, making less per hour. BNG specials. 15 minute specials. Whatever it takes--times are pretty bad.

$40--$50 for 10--15 minutes work, pretty good volume, adds up at the end of the week, along with the hourly appointments.

Standing in front of the pack with unique services is also a great idea that providers that are getting by nicely offer.

I like what you are saying, but gotta disagree about Dallas. I love the Dallas talent, but generally TCB is terrible (which I guess is just par for the course in this hobby), and the menus are not THAT great.

Originally Posted by karmanmia

A few of you are starting to stray from the topic at hand.. here's a good example of what this thread was about and how to keep it on topic!!! This was not started by me to be a platform for anyone's agendas or their opinions about what the women should charge. By all means express your concerns about not getting what you pay for, but it's not for you or me or anyone to tell a woman what she can charge for access to her body and mind. So PLEASE, again, let's stay on topic and have some meaningful discussion.

http://eccie.net/showthread.php?t=104625


Thanks again to those that are trying to get the messages across!

But it is the answer to your question! Lower prices is the key. There are other issues, but I will put up with more/same amount of bullshit for a lower price. Welcome to economics 101.

Originally Posted by kittyloveratx

Sorry, cutting stripper and hobby funds is not an expense. It is a luxury. And, I'm sorry to have to say, but the responses in this thread are interesting as once again its the exact same cast of male characters that seem to think being a provider is easy and since they were born with a vagina there is no additional cost. Especially the same old same old cast of characters that presume to speak for all of us. But then, when you find lately that there is 10 to 15 guys dominating the discussions and so few ladies choosing to participate, it makes one wonder.....

Just how good are we as a group involved in hobbling at promoting open and equal discussion between both sexes? If you look at the Austin forum as a whole I'm saying it is a totally dominated male board built around the mentality that a SW is $20 for bbbj so the whole gfe package shouldn't cost more than $100 to $150. Sorry, I'm tired of the male dominated, bullshit focused, small group of male posters dominating and trying to control this board under the refrain "This AIN'T ASPD" It sure as hell ain't, its 180 degrees totally opposite.

The bullshit has to stop. Sorry guys, but unless you have a cunt and fuck for money you need to shut up and stop trying to telling others how to run their business. You have two very simple choices in life - see them or not. Stop the bitching, whining, downgrading, etc.... Honestly between whispers, codybeast, 78704, sixxbach, and the rest with similar mental midgetry, I'm getting sick and tired of the machismo crap here. Did you notice that the posting count is down? That it takes hours and days for a sub-forum to get a post? Its not because the economy *supposedly* sucks, its because nobody gives a shit about this forum anymore. Putrid comes to mind when I think of the mentality exhibited by the posters here lately.

Its a hobby, not a life style - grow up, take off your wife beater t's, and stop thinking you can control everything in the hobby. Price is as they choose to price themselves at, either pay it or not.

I was going to really break this down, but Whispers beat me to it. But it boils down to that last sentence, and guess what? That's exactly what we are doing... not paying it. And that is why they are "starving" well, the answer is simple if you ask me.....

[Guest092710]

Thank you for reminding me what a fucking toilet this board has become thanks to people like you. I'll take my leave again........

And on that note.. please close my thread as it has run it's course. Thank you.

[rekcaSxT]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

Thank you for reminding me what a fucking toilet this board has become thanks to people like you. I'll take my leave again........

And on that note.. please close my thread as it has run it's course. Thank you.

Ever heard the phrase "can dish it out, but can't take it"?

Don't ask a question and when you don't like the answer just give up. Were you expecting to tell us the answer? Or for us to just simply agree?

The men on here gave valid answers. Most of these men are business men, they understand business. Providers could learn a lot from them, if they would listen.

[Guest060211-3]

I want to get a quick word in before it closes.

i agree with post #11 and several other post but dont have the time. hope this gets in on time.

peace
atx

p.s see you later karma

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

Thank you for reminding me what a fucking toilet this board has become thanks to people like you. I'll take my leave again........

And on that note.. please close my thread as it has run it's course. Thank you.

BEFORE this thread is closed!!!!!

I do believe it has been visited as well as addressed by admins/owners THAT A THREAD WILL NOT NECESSARILY BE CLOSED ON ECCIE SIMPLY BECAUSE THE OP REQUESTS IT AND WANTS IT CLOSED WHEN IT DOES NOT GO HER WAY.......

That was an ASPD policy many did not agree with and maybe one of the Internet Sleuths can dig that one up as I am sure I saw it somewhere and I do believe THIS is a thread that needs to stick around for a while......

Originally Posted by rekcaSxT

Ever heard the phrase "can dish it out, but can't take it"?

Don't ask a question and when you don't like the answer just give up. Were you expecting to tell us the answer? Or for us to just simply agree?

The men on here gave valid answers. Most of these men are business men, they understand business. Providers could learn a lot from them, if they would listen.

This thread HAS taken on a life of it's own, other ladies HAVE stated there is useful information coming from it.....and I am sure more will come if it is given a chance....

MUCH of the ECCIE Membership does not post on the weekends...

I would imagine a LOT of useful information will come from it over the course of the next few days....

Perhaps it might take some additional effort from MODs to Moderate it.....

But this thread should NOT be closed at the whim of the OP....

Let her leave if she chooses... Guest her account again for the (how many times now) .....

But Karma started a fairly decent thread that a lot can learn from whether or not she has the ability to steer it to the conclusion she wanted...

[78704]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

Thank you for reminding me what a fucking toilet this board has become thanks to people like you.

Seems to me that the potty mouth here is you. Ask a question and reprimand, threaten, and curse guys for answering, tut.

[lisa.lisa0302]

Holy cow

Lower your rates the men scream.

Really lower your rates? Are you sure?

For shits and giggles every provider is 100hr, and GFE.

Do you really want to wait your turn to see her, seriously, all the fast favorites and hard bodies will be too busy to see you, because they will honestly be too busy to see you. Although you might get one ride on the pony, is once really enough for everybody.

Isn't is disappointing to get that pm back saying sorry unavailable, because that is how it would be if every gal lower her rates. Everybody and the bum who begs for change can afford her.

You may actually get your wish and have a favorite lower her rates, good luck getting in the door to see her. And even hoping she picks up the phone, answer her pm and please have enough time for her to wash her ass in between calls.

[78704]

Originally Posted by karmanmia

I will ask you once politely to stop threatening, demeaning, belittling, and discouraging anyone that posts a response you don't agree with. This has been an honest and eye-opening thread for all of us here as it was intended. There is no reason at all for you to constantly bash every person that doesn't follow your directives implicitly. Not everyone is a lamb who will fall in stride with the rest of the sheeple.
Some of us have our own opinions as you do and I ASK one last time that you allow everyone to be heard without fear of being attacked by you.

Ironic.

[rekcaSxT]

Originally Posted by lisa.lisa0302

Holy cow

Lower your rates the men scream.

Really lower your rates? Are you sure?

For shits and giggles every provider is 100hr, and GFE.

Do you really want to wait your turn to see her, seriously, all the fast favorites and hard bodies will be too busy to see you, because they will honestly be too busy to see you. Although you might get one ride on the pony, is once really enough for everybody.

Isn't is disappointing to get that pm back saying sorry unavailable, because that is how it would be if every gal lower her rates. Everybody and the bum who begs for change can afford her.

You may actually get your wish and have a favorite lower her rates, good luck getting in the door to see her. And even hoping she picks up the phone, answer her pm and please have enough time for her to watch her ass in between calls.

We could ask the same question.

REALLY? you don't want to be busy? You don't want to be turning people away? Restaraunts LOVE that situation.

And if I get a PM back saying "sorry too busy" then I will be happy, because she has decent TCB.

[Elephant]

Originally Posted by rekcaSxT

And if I get a PM back saying "sorry too busy" then I will be happy, because she has decent TCB.

Ok, that was funny!

[austinkboy]

I think everyone has very good points. There isn't a wrong answer here, especially to a difficult question. If you ladies figure this one out perfectly, you can all retire comfortably in a couple of years. Yes, the economy sucks big time. I myself have been unemployed off and last couple of years, not knowing when and where my next dollar was coming from. Yes, I am sure that it is hard for especially those providers that depend on the hobby as their main source of income to make ends meet. Yes, on an hourly basis what you ladies make may not work out to what it is hyped up to be. But, as someone on this board says, this is supposed to be a hobby for us men, but it is a business for you ladies. And business is tough all over.

So how does a business obtain and keep consistently repeating customers? Just as with any small business, you need to be competitive with price and service that you offer (value). You need to decide who your customers are going to be, and target those individuals or group. You can't be everything to everyone. Keep up with the times, and keep yourself kept up (you can't sell outdated, obsolete or irrelevant product or services). Get to know your customers. If you want regulars, you need to know what days, hours work best for them to schedule a session. You need to know when you can safely contact them, and when you need to leave them alone. You need to know how to make them feel special without being fake. You need to figure out how to flirt with them and be their favorite without being clingy. You need to know which other ladies are on his favorite list, and how often he goes through the list before your normal turn comes up (chances are, the references he gave you are his regulars, and of course theres is P411). You may even get to know the other ladies on his favorite list, and if you have to cancel for some reason (like Aunt Flo suddenly visited), suggest someone already on his favorite list to take your place!

I don't know that undercutting the competition purely price wise is that necessary. (I am going get crucified by the guys here.) I just want to know that I am not being taken to the cleaners, or be made a victim. It is probably more important to match the services and the type experience (whether it's GFE, PSE, sensual, just plain fucking, etc.) with the price. By the time I decide I can treat myself to a $300 session, I've already made the price decision. If I decide I can only to $150 for HH this week, then I've made a different decision. I just have to match the best service and compatibility to me for the price point. I would much rather pay $300 consciously, and would be likely to repeat, rather than being subjected to upsell after I made the $150 decision and end up with $300. Yes, times are tough, and there are young girls offering supposedly the same menu at cheaper prices. But really, sometimes you want a $50 filet at a nice French restaurant with all of the art and mastery it takes to cook that chunk of meat, and other times, you just want steak at Sirloin Stockade, and at other times, you order a steak at Bone Daddy's, not for the steak but for the view.

You ladies need to know or figure out who (target market) you want as regulars, what price the market will bear, what services are wanted by that market, and how to reach that market. Do you want to be a shotgun (volume) or a rifle shot (targeted).

I will share my personal method to my madness. I am a little hesitant, since it is personal, but I guess there is no magic or great big secret that is that unique or odd, so here goes.

I, like many others have a "favorites list". I try to keep the list small, but as with a kid in an ice cream shop with many flavors, the smallest I've been able to keep this list is maybe about 4~5 ladies. Some of these ladies are in the upper price range, and I like to see them when I really want to feel like I am pampering myself. Others may be the girl next door type that I feel comfortable with, and can count on having great sex and companionship with every time. I have ladies in the list that are more adventurous that I can experiment with, but I have also had ladies that at first only provided limited menu (example, cbj and not bbbj). Of course everything was priced accordingly, but price was probably more a factor in the initial appointment, and not so much once on the favorite list. These are the ladies that I would like to be pampered by, and don't mind pampering if I can.

Then I have a "to do list". This is a list, mental or otherwise I have that I would like to try next opportunity. This could be a from a great review someone wrote, an ad that I saw, or someone that just caught my eyes. This list also includes someone I have seen before, but because they are from out of town, or because schedules usually don't work out, it is more of an opportunistic event for me to schedule.

Then there is the "just happened". This is not a list, but purely impulsive. Could be from short notice appointment because I suddenly have time/opportunity available, and the lady's ad just happened to pop up somewhere when I was looking. It could be because someone cancelled on me. It could be I needed instant gratification. It could be a combination of sudden urge, opportunity and availability of someone on the "to do list" (not necessarily on the top).

So, during any given "normal" month, I have a mixture of a few "favorites", one or two "to-do's" and maybe a "just happened". Ok, now that I've bared my soul, hopefully my "favorites" will be kind, understanding and tolerant of me! Which, btw is the key to keeping a stable of regular consistent clients. I love you all!