Trump NATO me,me,me

[Salty Again]

... All silly jibes and jests by you there, Preceus.

Too Funny for any conservative to take seriously.
Lads like you are the reason Biden is such a failure.

Maybe you can help Sleepy Joe defund the police...

### Salty

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by Precious_b

HF, ima gonna tell you, I don't follow this biden son bit

There in lies your first problem. How are you going to understand a story you don't follow?

Because as I said in the next sentence....

and Ukraine since with all the balleyhoo, nothing has been brought to court about it.

*NOW* if you can show me any case that is related to his son that is in court, PLEASE post it here.

And that surprises you with his dad as President and a House and Senate controlled by Democrats? You'll just have to wait till Nov./ Jan. before we'll see any real investigation of Hunter and "The Big Guy". You know who the big guy is, right?
What does the current status of a guys dad and who is majority or minority on the Hill have to do with it? As I stated, show me a case that has been brought to court about him. *ANYBODY* can bring a case to court. You can also show me that a case can't be brought to court because of someones political office?
That's just stupid to say. And donny had 4 years to push a case with courts that he helped rig thanks to mitch. If there ever was an easy pitch to hit that was it. So, if it didn't happen than, what makes you think waiting is going to help? Justice delayed...

Lord knows I read that he withheld over $100M to have supposed charges dropped. That was proved false.

Are you saying that Trump withheld money to have charges dropped? What charges? I really don't know what you are talking about but I'll give you a suggestion about debating, if you are going to say "something" ( at this point I have no idea what you are talking about ) was proven false, site the proof or is that to much to ask from someone who admits he doesn't follow this story?
I'll leave this alone and allow me to retract because I was mentioning something else about biden and I don't want to take away from the point I brought up. (I only put it there because there are a 1,001 things shouted by both parties.)

Don't torture me with tiktok videos that people tout.

What the hell are you talking about? I've never been on TikTok and I certainly never posted any video from that site.
That one is entirely my fault. I addressed you by initials and to the best of my knowledge, you don't post those. *I* have been dealing with them from someone else who practically uses them as their only source of information. I still don't think it has sunk in to them that tiktok is owned by the Chinese

And the only thing I listened to with donny and Ukrainian president is the documented shake down of him. Post whatever excuse he was hiding about behind with his "perfect phonecall."


Documented? By who? And if it's "documented", you should be able to provide that documentation. Certainly not Zelinsky who said on more than one occasion that Trump never asked him to do what is being suggested and it sure as hell isn't in the transcript of the phone call. Have you read the transcript of the phone call? Can you point to the shake down part or are you merely parroting what you have heard from the opposition party? And once again, if you are going to say that there was a shake down, prove it, show us the words that prove the shake down. You seem to be very proud of the limited amount of information you possess.
The White House. That's who. I ain't gonna pay $$$ to get the *official* transcript but it has not been proved a lie. And you are wrong. donny did do, not as I "suggested", he did as I said which is stated in the official White House transcript. Go ahead. Read the transcript yourself.
If you can prove it's false, please do as you say and supply the source.

Biden did strong arm the AG.

As in offering a quid pro quo, right?
I use to use that phrase before donny.

And other leaders in European countries agreed with his actions since the guy is known to be corrupt.

So in the law against quid pro quo, it says that it is alright if certain people, the right kind of people agree with you, you can do it? Can you show me that? People accused Trump of offering Zelensky a quid pro quo, that wasn't proven in the phone call and Zelensky denied it, but maybe if it had happened, it would be OK because some people agreed with Trump? A bit of twisted logic.
I am merely stating that funds that the Hill granted to Ukraine were held up by donny for his own personal gain. Look at the transcript (unless you prove it is fake....and that's a hard one to do with Politico....you will plainly see it yourself. If you can't find it in there, I will put the specific section here.

Ukraine definitely was a shady place.

Hence Trump's concern about giving them 400 million dollars in aid.
Uh, no. The people who elected the congress members gave the money. donny was there to rubberstamp it. But he wanted personal gain, might I add, from money that wasn't his, before he would sign it off.

That is how the current pres came to power there. The people thought anything has got to be better so why not elect a actor who portrays a president.

All this shit needs to be put on a backburner with the current situation. Doesn't help anything. Guess we are lucky that we can armchair it on a hooker board.




Yes, we are just talking here. And thank god we were given that Right a long time ago. And if people realize that, GOOD! If not, *we* are helping them.

Like how you closed your post there, HF.

So let me see if I understand your reasoning. A story peculating in the news, testimony and documents given to the FBI by Tony Bobulinski. All the documents of Hunter Biden's laptop and deals.... none of that interests you and will only interest you if and when it goes to court? But then you appear here talking about many things that have never been in a court room but widely discussed in the media. See my problem with your logic here.

*ANYBODY* can bring a case to court.

That's just stupid to say.

I agree


False.







https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/criminal_complaint#:~:text=A%2 0criminal%20complaint%20is%20a lso,individuals%20to%20file%20 criminal%20complaints.



A “criminal complaint” is a self-contained charge that sets forth the sufficient facts that, with reasonable inferences, allow a person to reasonably conclude that a crime was probably committed and that the suspect, defendant, is likely culpable.

A criminal complaint is also known as a felony complaint, and is slightly different from a civil complaint. Instead of an individual filing the complaint, the government usually files the criminal complaint against the individual. However, some states do allow individuals to file criminal complaints. Essentially, it’s a judicial order, court-issued document, that charges the suspect, defendant with specific crimes.

You can also show me that a case can't be brought to court because of someones political office?

Never said any such thing. It's not a case of "can't", it's a case of "want". Take James Comey and Hillary. Comey could have easily prosecuted Hillary. Hell, I've posted several times in this forum, Congressional testimony where Comey admits Hillary lied to him and to the CC but he chose not to out of sympathy for Hillary. Was he trying to protect a "political high up" and would have prosecuted a lesser person for the same offense which is documented to have happened to a sailor taking pictures about his submarine. Nobody ever suggested he had nefarious motives but they prosecuted him anyway because "the law is the law". Well, if the law is the law, why wasn't Hillary prosecuted? Answer, Comey didn't "want" for what ever reason.

I ain't gonna pay $$$ to get the *official* transcript but it has not been proved a lie.

Uh, it's on the internet and it's free!!! Here you go, the conversation that you say proves that Trump pressured Zelinsky to do something illegal which Zelinsky repeatedly said did not happen.


https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/25/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-transcript-call/index.html



Read Trump’s phone conversation with Volodymyr Zelensky

The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The way you came from behind, somebody who wasn’t given much of a chance, and you ended up winning easily. It’s a fantastic achievement. Congratulations.


President Zelenskyy: You are absolutely right Mr. President. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example for our elections and yes it is true that these were unique elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to achieve a unique success. I’m able to tell you the following; the first time you called me to congratulate me when I won my presidential election, and the second time you are now calling me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I should run more often so you can call me more often and we can talk over the phone more often.


The President: (laughter) That’s a very good idea. I think your country is very happy about that.


President Zelenskyy: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp here in our country. We brought in many many new people. Not the old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great teacher for us and in that.


The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.


President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.


The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.


President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.


The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The way you came from behind, somebody who wasn’t given much of a chance, and you ended up winning easily. It’s a fantastic achievement. Congratulations.


President Zelenskyy: You are absolutely right Mr. President. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example for our elections and yes it is true that these were unique elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to achieve a unique success. I’m able to tell you the following; the first time you called me to congratulate me when I won my presidential election, and the second time you are now calling me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I should run more often so you can call me more often and we can talk over the phone more often.


The President: (laughter) That’s a very good idea. I think your country is very happy about that.


President Zelenskyy: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp here in our country. We brought in many many new people. Not the old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great teacher for us and in that.


The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.


President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.


The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.


President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.


The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that’s really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just want to let you know that. The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it… It sounds horrible to me.


President Zelenskyy: I wanted to tell you about the prosecutor. First of all, I understand and I’m knowledgeable about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in our Parliament, the next prosecutor general will be 100% my person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look into the situation, specifically to the company that you mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the case is actually the issue of making sure to restore the honesty so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have any additional information that you can provide to us, it would be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we administer justice in our country with regard to the Ambassador to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name was Ivanovich. It was great that you were the first one who told me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree with you 100%. Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept me as a new President well enough.


The President: Well, she’s going to go through some things. I will have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I’m sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets. It’s a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, their incredible people.


President Zelenskyy: I would like to tell you that I also have quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United States. Actually last time I traveled to the United States, I stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy independence. I believe we can be very successful and cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and more opportunities to discuss these opportunities and get to know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for your support.


The President: Good. Well, thank you very much and I appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House, feel free to call. Give us a date and we’ll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.


President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much. I would be very happy to come and would be happy to meet with you personally and get to know you better. I am looking forward to our meeting and I also would like to invite you to visit Ukraine and come to the city of Kyiv which is a beautiful city. We have a beautiful country which would welcome you. On the other hand, I believe that on September 1 we will be in Poland and we can meet in Poland hopefully. After that, it might be a very good idea for you to travel to Ukraine. We can either take my plane and go to Ukraine or we can take your plane, which is probably much better than mine.


The President: Okay, we can work that out. I look forward to seeing you in Washington and maybe in Poland because I think we are going to be there at that time.


President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much Mr. President.


The President: Congratulations on a fantastic job you’ve done. The whole world was watching. I’m not sure it was so much of an upset but congratulations.


President Zelenskyy: Thank you Mr. President bye-bye.

Now, I have highlighted in red the part of the call dealing with Trump asking Zelinsky to "look into Hunter".... Did that sound like an illegal ultimatum to you? An illegal quid pro quo? I'll await your analysis and explain to me how that constituted an illegal act worthy of impeachment.

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by Salty Again

... All silly jibes and jests by you there, Preceus.

Too Funny for any conservative to take seriously.
Lads like you are the reason Biden is such a failure.

Maybe you can help Sleepy Joe defund the police...

### Salty

Aw! I must of kicked one too many joeys there Salt Lick.
But it'd take a few Fosters to recip any serious verbage from the stuff you post. So, i'd guess we'd both be hoisting a few.
And i'd have to say your lot banging on keyboards and working to restrict the vote is the reason donny was a failure. And y'all thought you could get by with a minority of the voting public twice. Should have took a page from Clintons book since he never made the same mistake twice

[HedonistForever]

I hope you are working on finding that part of the phone call that proves Trump "pressured" Zelinsky to "make up dirt on Biden if you have to" as Adam Schiff once suggested was said by Trump. Sure, later Schiff hemmed and hawed and half ass admitted that Trump didn't really say that but then, it had already been said. Show me the words that translate to "pressure". Show me the quid pro quo that was so often quoted by the Democrats and media at the time.


It isn't there. All that is there is "do me a favor", which in and of itself is not illegal. To be illegal, there would have to be that quid pro quo which only Joe Biden is guilty of.


But hey, I'm anxious to see what you come up with.

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

So let me see if I understand your reasoning. A story peculating in the news, testimony and documents given to the FBI by Tony Bobulinski. All the documents of Hunter Biden's laptop and deals.... none of that interests you and will only interest you if and when it goes to court? But then you appear here talking about many things that have never been in a court room but widely discussed in the media. See my problem with your logic here.







I agree


False.







https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/criminal_complaint#:~:text=A%2 0criminal%20complaint%20is%20a lso,individuals%20to%20file%20 criminal%20complaints.



A “criminal complaint” is a self-contained charge that sets forth the sufficient facts that, with reasonable inferences, allow a person to reasonably conclude that a crime was probably committed and that the suspect, defendant, is likely culpable.

A criminal complaint is also known as a felony complaint, and is slightly different from a civil complaint. Instead of an individual filing the complaint, the government usually files the criminal complaint against the individual. However, some states do allow individuals to file criminal complaints. Essentially, it’s a judicial order, court-issued document, that charges the suspect, defendant with specific crimes.





Never said any such thing. It's not a case of "can't", it's a case of "want". Take James Comey and Hillary. Comey could have easily prosecuted Hillary. Hell, I've posted several times in this forum, Congressional testimony where Comey admits Hillary lied to him and to the CC but he chose not to out of sympathy for Hillary. Was he trying to protect a "political high up" and would have prosecuted a lesser person for the same offense which is documented to have happened to a sailor taking pictures about his submarine. Nobody ever suggested he had nefarious motives but they prosecuted him anyway because "the law is the law". Well, if the law is the law, why wasn't Hillary prosecuted? Answer, Comey didn't "want" for what ever reason.






Uh, it's on the internet and it's free!!! Here you go, the conversation that you say proves that Trump pressured Zelinsky to do something illegal which Zelinsky repeatedly said did not happen.


https://www.cnn.com/2019/09/25/politics/donald-trump-ukraine-transcript-call/index.html



Read Trump’s phone conversation with Volodymyr Zelensky

The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The way you came from behind, somebody who wasn’t given much of a chance, and you ended up winning easily. It’s a fantastic achievement. Congratulations.


President Zelenskyy: You are absolutely right Mr. President. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example for our elections and yes it is true that these were unique elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to achieve a unique success. I’m able to tell you the following; the first time you called me to congratulate me when I won my presidential election, and the second time you are now calling me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I should run more often so you can call me more often and we can talk over the phone more often.


The President: (laughter) That’s a very good idea. I think your country is very happy about that.


President Zelenskyy: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp here in our country. We brought in many many new people. Not the old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great teacher for us and in that.


The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.


President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.


The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.


President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.


The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The way you came from behind, somebody who wasn’t given much of a chance, and you ended up winning easily. It’s a fantastic achievement. Congratulations.


President Zelenskyy: You are absolutely right Mr. President. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example for our elections and yes it is true that these were unique elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to achieve a unique success. I’m able to tell you the following; the first time you called me to congratulate me when I won my presidential election, and the second time you are now calling me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I should run more often so you can call me more often and we can talk over the phone more often.


The President: (laughter) That’s a very good idea. I think your country is very happy about that.


President Zelenskyy: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp here in our country. We brought in many many new people. Not the old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great teacher for us and in that.


The President: Well it is very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she ·doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very very good to Ukraine.


President Zelenskyy: Yes you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her I also met and talked with Macron and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps specifically we are almost. ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.


The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike… I guess you have one of your wealthy people… The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation. I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you saw yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.


President Zelenskyy: Yes it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer. I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so. I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us. I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you Mr. President have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly.. That I can assure you.


The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that’s really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just want to let you know that. The other thing, There’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it… It sounds horrible to me.


President Zelenskyy: I wanted to tell you about the prosecutor. First of all, I understand and I’m knowledgeable about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in our Parliament, the next prosecutor general will be 100% my person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look into the situation, specifically to the company that you mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the case is actually the issue of making sure to restore the honesty so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have any additional information that you can provide to us, it would be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we administer justice in our country with regard to the Ambassador to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name was Ivanovich. It was great that you were the first one who told me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree with you 100%. Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept me as a new President well enough.


The President: Well, she’s going to go through some things. I will have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I’m sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets. It’s a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, their incredible people.


President Zelenskyy: I would like to tell you that I also have quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United States. Actually last time I traveled to the United States, I stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy independence. I believe we can be very successful and cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and more opportunities to discuss these opportunities and get to know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for your support.


The President: Good. Well, thank you very much and I appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House, feel free to call. Give us a date and we’ll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.


President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much. I would be very happy to come and would be happy to meet with you personally and get to know you better. I am looking forward to our meeting and I also would like to invite you to visit Ukraine and come to the city of Kyiv which is a beautiful city. We have a beautiful country which would welcome you. On the other hand, I believe that on September 1 we will be in Poland and we can meet in Poland hopefully. After that, it might be a very good idea for you to travel to Ukraine. We can either take my plane and go to Ukraine or we can take your plane, which is probably much better than mine.


The President: Okay, we can work that out. I look forward to seeing you in Washington and maybe in Poland because I think we are going to be there at that time.


President Zelenskyy: Thank you very much Mr. President.


The President: Congratulations on a fantastic job you’ve done. The whole world was watching. I’m not sure it was so much of an upset but congratulations.


President Zelenskyy: Thank you Mr. President bye-bye.

Now, I have highlighted in red the part of the call dealing with Trump asking Zelinsky to "look into Hunter".... Did that sound like an illegal ultimatum to you? An illegal quid pro quo? I'll await your analysis and explain to me how that constituted an illegal act worthy of impeachment.

That link you got ain't working. But *I* will assume you are quoting it below. So, when it says the Goverment files the complaint, does it mean a specific branch of goverment? The Solicitor General? Why can't a member of Congress file a case? I don't expect you to edumacate me on that

"You can also show me that a case can't be brought to court because of someones political office?" I didn't say you said that. I was just asking.

With the Comey/Hillary thing, there have been other cases where lies have been stated and for one reason or another left alone. Now drawing conclusions about "sympathy" and stuff are specualtion, unless otherwise stated. But with other cases, lies have been overlooked for one reason or another. As *I* state with my job when looking for a problem, I have the customer tell me everything about their problem. 9/10 times they will lie about something. But I know their intention is not to. They get lost in details or one thing or another. Bottom line, it is not meant to be with bad intent. As with your example and others on the same level, not all lies are in a criminal scope. But the one thing about Hillary is that her lawyer background can make anything come off looking bad. Like, who loves lawyer? LOL! I ain't praising her. But I will say others have "lied" without the intent to be criminal. It is possible for that to happen.

I didn't want to insult you by using a libby link. As i've stated in the past, I don't watch CNN. But that was the first link that came up with the transcript and I wasn't gonna give fodder for others to jump on the source I chose. But your link and mine have same stuff.

And where did I say "Trump pressured Zelinsky to do something illegal"? I said he leveraged his position in office to use other peoples money for his own personal gain. Now, if you see that as illegal, than your freudian slip is showing.

I see you conveniently left off the part where he was doing as I said. Reread him mentioning the "server."

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by Precious_b

That link you got ain't working. But *I* will assume you are quoting it below. So, when it says the Goverment files the complaint, does it mean a specific branch of goverment?


The AG in co-ordination with the DOJ



The Solicitor General? Why can't a member of Congress file a case? I don't expect you to edumacate me on that


Hell, it's my sole purpose in being here is to educate you!


https://www.mololamken.com/knowledge-What-Exactly-Does-Congress-Have-the-Authority-To-Investigate


While Congress can investigate conduct that may be criminal, Congress itself lacks the authority to bring criminal charges or otherwise initiate a criminal prosecution. If a congressional investigation uncovers evidence of criminal activity, however, Congress may refer the matter to the Department of Justice for investigation and, potentially, prosecution.


Sometimes, the DOJ investigation predates the congressional investigation. No matter which branch of government moves first to investigate, however, the end result is that a congressional investigation often will run parallel to a criminal investigation. As a result, evidence developed in a congressional investigation might be used by the DOJ in its criminal investigation or in a prosecution.

"You can also show me that a case can't be brought to court because of someones political office?" I didn't say you said that. I was just asking.


True I didn't say that but the only office protected from indictment ( as I understand it ) is a sitting President. That is why Mueller, even if he had found the evidence he sought, could only report it but could not indict, that is what impeachment is for.


With the Comey/Hillary thing, there have been other cases where lies have been stated and for one reason or another left alone.



And that's fine as long as it works for both parties. The problem comes in when only a certain party gets prosecuted for the same crime the other party did not. EQUAL JUSTICE UNDER THE LAW. Do that, and I'm happy.


Now drawing conclusions about "sympathy" and stuff are specualtion, unless otherwise stated.



True but what would we do here if not speculate? One dumbass on here ( that will remain nameless ) said that we should discuss nothing but facts here as if it's ever that clear what facts are in the world of politics. We aren't discussing math and science here where facts are often disputed as well.


Bottom line, it is not meant to be with bad intent. As with your example and others on the same level, not all lies are in a criminal scope. But the one thing about Hillary is that her lawyer background can make anything come off looking bad.



Problem with what Comey did, saying he saw no intent to break the law, he also said Hillary was a person with enough experience to know she was breaking the law and then didn't indict.




I didn't want to insult you by using a libby link.


Hell, I use liberal links sometimes when they get their facts right. I appreciate a link because sometimes it's easier to debate.


As i've stated in the past, I don't watch CNN. But that was the first link that came up with the transcript and I wasn't gonna give fodder for others to jump on the source I chose. But your link and mine have same stuff.


Which begs the question, where do you get the information you most rely on? Don't be shy, I won't tell.


And where did I say "Trump pressured Zelinsky to do something illegal"? I said he leveraged his position in office to use other peoples money for his own personal gain.


Then you don't see anything in that phone call that Trump was impeached over as illegal?


Now, if you see that as illegal, than your freudian slip is showing.


Trump University!!!!!! Nuff said.


I see you conveniently left off the part where he was doing as I said. Reread him mentioning the "server."

Come on man, be specific, don't make me try and guess what you are talking about. Sounds like you are back tracking to me because I thought this whole discussion was the Democrats point that what Trump said in that phone call was illegal and impeachable. It sure sounded to me like you thought the same.

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by Precious_b View Post
That link you got ain't working. But *I* will assume you are quoting it below. So, when it says the Goverment files the complaint, does it mean a specific branch of goverment?


The AG in co-ordination with the DOJ



The Solicitor General? Why can't a member of Congress file a case? I don't expect you to edumacate me on that


Hell, it's my sole purpose in being here is to educate you!

Daddy, you're failing me here greatly LOL!
Can't you just give me the $$$ for tuition instead


https://www.mololamken.com/knowledge...To-Investigate


While Congress can investigate conduct that may be criminal, Congress itself lacks the authority to bring criminal charges or otherwise initiate a criminal prosecution. If a congressional investigation uncovers evidence of criminal activity, however, Congress may refer the matter to the Department of Justice for investigation and, potentially, prosecution.


Sometimes, the DOJ investigation predates the congressional investigation. No matter which branch of government moves first to investigate, however, the end result is that a congressional investigation often will run parallel to a criminal investigation. As a result, evidence developed in a congressional investigation might be used by the DOJ in its criminal investigation or in a prosecution.

"You can also show me that a case can't be brought to court because of someones political office?" I didn't say you said that. I was just asking.


True I didn't say that but the only office protected from indictment ( as I understand it ) is a sitting President. That is why Mueller, even if he had found the evidence he sought, could only report it but could not indict, that is what impeachment is for.

GOOD! Because that's all ima saying. If someone has a case to bring to court, DO IT!
Doesn't matter the time.....unless they lollygag. (Justice delayed remark I made.) And Mueller already knew you couldn't indict a sitting president. But that wasn't his pay grade to state and act upon.

With the Comey/Hillary thing, there have been other cases where lies have been stated and for one reason or another left alone.



And that's fine as long as it works for both parties. The problem comes in when only a certain party gets prosecuted for the same crime the other party did not. EQUAL JUSTICE UNDER THE LAW. Do that, and I'm happy.

*sigh* Unfortunately that happens quite a bit. And I agree with you.


Now drawing conclusions about "sympathy" and stuff are specualtion, unless otherwise stated.



True but what would we do here if not speculate? One dumbass on here ( that will remain nameless ) said that we should discuss nothing but facts here as if it's ever that clear what facts are in the world of politics. We aren't discussing math and science here where facts are often disputed as well.


We could whine and complain about the cost of pussy and where all the hot chicks went

Bottom line, it is not meant to be with bad intent. As with your example and others on the same level, not all lies are in a criminal scope. But the one thing about Hillary is that her lawyer background can make anything come off looking bad.



Problem with what Comey did, saying he saw no intent to break the law, he also said Hillary was a person with enough experience to know she was breaking the law and then didn't indict.

That "held to a higher standard" thing.
I have to say, that is one thing about the office of President. You are the leader of the country. And you have to take responsibility for things. Good or bad.
Tell me what bad did trump take responsibility for?
I know I see unforgivable things for most administrations I remember. And I see a few of those actions being accounted for by those in office at the time. I have never seen any accountability with trump.




I didn't want to insult you by using a libby link.


Hell, I use liberal links sometimes when they get their facts right. I appreciate a link because sometimes it's easier to debate.

I try to use a link that is near center and highly factual. But if a conservative person is who i'm responding to, i'll link a slightly right center link for them that I strive to be highly factual.

As i've stated in the past, I don't watch CNN. But that was the first link that came up with the transcript and I wasn't gonna give fodder for others to jump on the source I chose. But your link and mine have same stuff.


Which begs the question, where do you get the information you most rely on? Don't be shy, I won't tell.

I've never been shy about it. Stated it a few times. ABC national news and OAN. I am in the deep habit until i go to the grave to having the radio on 24/7 in my bedroom on non-commercial stations. Read that as National Palestinian Radio and college stations. I always paid for my music. That Juan Williams thing had me cut funds for awhile.

And where did I say "Trump pressured Zelinsky to do something illegal"? I said he leveraged his position in office to use other peoples money for his own personal gain.


Then you don't see anything in that phone call that Trump was impeached over as illegal?


*I* see what *I* stated: he leveraged his position in office to use other peoples money for his own personal gain.

Now, if you see that as illegal, than your freudian slip is showing.


Trump University!!!!!! Nuff said.



I see you conveniently left off the part where he was doing as I said. Reread him mentioning the "server."

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

Come on man, be specific, don't make me try and guess what you are talking about. Sounds like you are back tracking to me because I thought this whole discussion was the Democrats point that what Trump said in that phone call was illegal and impeachable. It sure sounded to me like you thought the same.

I was specific. Do a search of that transcript for server.
And my whole point was the response to WYID:

Yes, the Mueller investigation took awhile and cost some bucks, it did have conclusions.

Putin did order interference in 2016 U.S. election.
Manafort actively interacted with Russian intelligence for political gain.
Had Stone use Wikileaks for same.
Steele dossier having undue influence on FBI (I love bring up that document since it was started by the repubs.)
Redacted potential criminal activities.

[Salty Again]

... You're a joke, Preceus... Which is why you continuously
get schooled by the lads here each and every day.

... Keep defending Sleepy Joe and the corrupt DC Swamp.
It's surely entertaining to watch...

#### Salty

[winn dixie]

Originally Posted by Salty Again

... You're a joke, Preceus... Which is why you continuously
get schooled by the lads here each and every day.

... Keep defending Sleepy Joe and the corrupt DC Swamp.
It's surely entertaining to watch...

#### Salty

Ask him about doc the varmint

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by Salty Again

... You're a joke, Preceus... Which is why you continuously
get schooled by the lads here each and every day.

... Keep defending Sleepy Joe and the corrupt DC Swamp.
It's surely entertaining to watch...

#### Salty

Hey Salt Lick!

Glad I succeeded in getting you a laugh. Gotta say that is at least one up on you in accomplishing something.

Maybe 2. Show where I mention biden as doing something with the Mueller report. Come on. It ain't that difficult. The report is under the Judicial branch. And you'll have to show specifically where I was schooled. That might make it 3 up on you. That would require you to make a cognizant, concise, precise point that can be supported. HF is light years ahead of you on that. And maybe a RIF course would be in order since there are multiple points I made that were in agreement.

Nevermind. We don't need to die laughing here. I ain't jealous of sharing the mic.

[Precious_b]

Don't we have enough lurkers here?!