Trump and the anthem

[Austin Ellen]

Good point - I think a lot of people have season passes that are not showing up yet they are counted as occupied seats.
I wonder how they count attendance?

Originally Posted by derek303

Was the attendance butts in the seats or sold tickets? Seriously....I don't know 1 Republican that is on my FB that isn't boycotting a little to a lot. Some are saying that they can't give up on their team (Cowboys etc) but fuck the rest of them. Meaning they aren't watching that 2nd or 3rd game that week they usually do. To most of them saying Fuck it all. I'm in that last group. I haven't watched 20 plays in the last 6 weeks or so. Did anybody see Vin Scully say he will never watch another NFL game? He was the voice of the Dodgers for over 50 years.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by derek303

Was the attendance butts in the seats or sold tickets? Seriously....I don't know 1 Republican that is on my FB that isn't boycotting a little to a lot. Some are saying that they can't give up on their team (Cowboys etc) but fuck the rest of them. Meaning they aren't watching that 2nd or 3rd game that week they usually do. To most of them saying Fuck it all. I'm in that last group. I haven't watched 20 plays in the last 6 weeks or so. Did anybody see Vin Scully say he will never watch another NFL game? He was the voice of the Dodgers for over 50 years.

I don't have the answer to your first question. However, the games I looked in on over the weekend and last night it was hard to see an empty seat. The average price for an NFL ticket is in the 100s of dollars. Very few fans are going to throw away that money to make a point.

Vin Scully, although I have the utmost respect for him, is an old, white man and as I've said before, that seems to be the profile of most of the people protesting the protesters. I, as an old, white man, have never undergone prejudice due to my race. Very few black men can say that. If the young, black NFL players believe that taking a knee during the National Anthem is the best way to emphasize their point, and the NFL does not disallow it, I support them. As a veteran it does not bother me one bit.

[Austin Ellen]

Well, good for you. I can tell you that it bothers a whole hell of lot of other veterans. Veterans who retired after 25 years or more of service - they do not like it. It is an insult.

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

I don't have the answer to your first question. However, the games I looked in on over the weekend and last night it was hard to see an empty seat. The average price for an NFL ticket is in the 100s of dollars. Very few fans are going to throw away that money to make a point.

Vin Scully, although I have the utmost respect for him, is an old, white man and as I've said before, that seems to be the profile of most of the people protesting the protesters. I, as an old, white man, have never undergone prejudice due to my race. Very few black men can say that. If the young, black NFL players believe that taking a knee during the National Anthem is the best way to emphasize their point, and the NFL does not disallow it, I support them. As a veteran it does not bother me one bit.

[zerodark13]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

Well, good for you. I can tell you that it bothers a whole hell of lot of other veterans. Veterans who retired after 25 years or more of service - they do not like it. It is an insult.

I was just at a gathering of veterans from every service branch last weekend, from a wide variety of political backgrounds, some even voted for Trump. Not one of them give even the littlest shit about anyone kneeling, dancing, farting, whatever during the anthem. What they are universally concerned about is the possibility of your orange boyfriend starting WW3 with N Korea or Iran.

I’ve posted this before, and I’ll keep posting it so long as dimwits like you want to speak for veterans like me: Kneeling has been a way to show respect for thousands of years, as a sign of fealty, to show obeisance, to surrender. Only a fool or an uneducated buffoon would interpret kneeling as disrespectful. Which of those are you?

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

Well, good for you. I can tell you that it bothers a whole hell of lot of other veterans. Veterans who retired after 25 years or more of service - they do not like it. It is an insult.

I can tell you that it doesn't bother a whole hell of a lot veterans also. So why discount and try to make it seem like there isn't a lot of vets who don't care about the kneeling?

And it's not an insult because the players aren't kneeling or protesting against the vets, anthem or flag. The sooner people stop spreading that lie, the sooner we can start talking about the real issue they are protesting (social injustice) and we can start making progress on that. Then the players can stop kneeling and all of this could go away.

[Aroundagain]

There it goes again, speaking for veterans. Why don't you let that little facade go? Football is still on, stands are packed, and for someone who doesn't care for NFL football anymore there sure are a lot of comments coming from you? Lastly, I have a network of over 1500 veterans that I served with and maybe 100 of them are saying they don't approve of the kneeling. I'll take those numbers any day to prove a point!

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

Well, good for you. I can tell you that it bothers a whole hell of lot of other veterans. Veterans who retired after 25 years or more of service - they do not like it. It is an insult.

That is fine. I didn't say I am right to feel the way I feel, and I am not saying other veterans who disagree with me are right to feel the way they feel.

And how many of the veterans for whom you are speaking are black as compared to white? I'll bet black veterans do not consider it an insult. 90% of black Americans support the protesters.

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

That is fine. I didn't say I am right to feel the way I feel, and I am not saying other veterans who disagree with me are right to feel the way they feel.

And how many of the veterans for whom you are speaking are black as compared to white? I'll bet black veterans do not consider it an insult. 90% of black Americans support the protesters.

No way that black vets think it's an insult. Maybe there are a few but I would wager that that number is extremely low.

Odds are she will say at least 1 was black, otherwise it's not as strong of a statement she's making.

[gfejunkie]

Originally Posted by Austin Dude

And it's not an insult because the players aren't kneeling or protesting against the vets, anthem or flag.

Then why do it during the national anthem? It is an insult to all patriotic Americans and is intended to be so. Do it some other place, some other time.

This is exactly why the broadcasters have stopped airing the beginning of the games. Out of sight, out of mind. They know what's best for them. DON"T PISS OFF YOUR CUSTOMERS!

[Observing]

Originally Posted by gfejunkie

Then why do it during the national anthem? It is an insult to all patriotic Americans and is intended to be so. Do it some other place, some other time.

This is exactly why the broadcasters have stopped airing the beginning of the games. Out of sight, out of mind. They know what's best for them. DON"T PISS OFF YOUR CUSTOMERS!

"CUSTOMERS" have spoken at the ballot box!

Democrat Ralph Northam elected governor of Virginia
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/07/demo...twitter%7Cmain

Historic Democrat Wave Wiping Out Virginia GOP
https://www.redstate.com/neil_steven...-virginia-gop/

Democrats win control of Washington state Senate
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign...n-state-senate

First openly transgender state legislator elected in Virginia
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign...ed-in-virginia

Ravi Bhalla wins Hoboken election, becomes N.J.'s first Sikh mayor
http://www.nj.com/hudson/index.ssf/2...oral_race.html

[gfejunkie]

That is what happens to Republican candidates who do not support the President's agenda. Best lesson to be learned going into 2018.

[gfejunkie]

Originally Posted by Austin Dude

Commerce Secretary was partners with Putin’s son in law and didn’t disclose. That’s odd.

Oh and let’s not forget about this:
https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/a...ow-lawyer-says

Can’t wait for the narrative to change to well we were working with Russia but that’s not illegal. And for all the Trump minions who are scream no collusion to magically switch their tune and say of course it was but that’s not wrong.

It's starting to look more and more like Don Jr. was set up by Fusion GPS. Good thing Mueller is taking a hard look at Fusion...

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...-sit-down.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...mear-firm.html

Who knows what he might find?

[Observing]

Originally Posted by gfejunkie

That is what happens to Republican candidates who do not support the President's agenda. Best lesson to be learned going into 2018.

Ya mean slobbering down the willfully ignorant combo platter of racism,bigotry and general fuckery?
Got it!

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by gfejunkie

Then why do it during the national anthem? It is an insult to all patriotic Americans and is intended to be so. Do it some other place, some other time.

This is exactly why the broadcasters have stopped airing the beginning of the games. Out of sight, out of mind. They know what's best for them. DON"T PISS OFF YOUR CUSTOMERS!

You do it during the anthem because they are protesting. When you protest, you do it as a spectacle to get people's attention about your cause. During hunger strikes, you aren't protesting food. Doing bus boycotts you aren't boycotting buses. Hell the people protesting the NFL aren't doing it about the league, it's about what the players are doing. Funny they can understand that when they boycott.

You can't tell a person what they boycott means. And you can't tell people what insults them. It's not insulting all patriots because all patriotic Americans don't agree that it's insulting. And the players have said what they are boycotting, social injustice. Yet you want to call them liars. And you tell them what their intentions are. How wise of you to tell these men what they are boycotting and the intentions they have. Funny, you would flip your shit if someone did the same for you.

And you don't have the right to tell a person when and where they protest. That's their right. There is no rule against them doing it. They are calling for equity in our country, which everyone should want. It's a peaceful protest. They have the support of many vets. So it's not insulting vets. And when and where would you like them to protest?

The the sad thing about this is people like you losing your shit over players kneeling during the anthem as a protest, telling them to stop and do it somewhere else. Yet y'all won't call out white supremacist marching in the streets because, hey that's their right. And a person like me, who says the players and the white supremacist both have the right to protest. And what the white supremacists are protesting is horrible and violent and I still recognize their rights. I guess it's another instance of #gtbw

[Austin Dude]

Originally Posted by gfejunkie

That is what happens to Republican candidates who do not support the President's agenda. Best lesson to be learned going into 2018.

Actually Ed Gillespie did wrap himself in all the culture wars that Trump does, which is what you do because Trump has no agenda. He talked about confederate monuments, immigration, MS-13, DACA, sanctuary cities, etc. And guess what happened? The Democratic bases came out strong against Trump. Look at the exit polls. A higher percentage in both NJ and VA came out to oppose Trump than to support Trump. The biggest issue for the voters polled in VA was healthcare, and 78% of those voters went for the Democrat.