Sharia law

[Cpalmson]

First off, Oklahoma passed a law similar to Kansas, and some left wing nut job of a judge ruled the law (which passed by an overwhelming majority of Oklahomans) to be Unconstitutional. That judge needs to go. He's an idiot, liberal, PC, moronic fool.

Secondly, the last time I checked, it was 19 MUSLIMs who took out the twin towers, dented the Pentagon and tried to take out the Capitol. So, yes, it is okay, fine and dandy to paint all MUSLIMS with a broad brush. Some of you Muslim sympathizers really need to understand what Sharia Law is. If you want a refresher, think Old Testament "Eye for an Eye" type justice. This is the same law that sanctions "Honor Killings" and essentially treats all women as property. Do we really want that shit here? Take a look at Europe. Over the past 30 years or so, they have foolishly allowed Muslims it immigrate. At the same time, these Muslims for the most part have not assimilated into European society. The radicals are hell bent on bringing Muslim culture to Europe. To be honest, they are pretty much fucked over there. The problem is the moderate Muslims lack the balls to stand up to the radicals. The moderates sheepishly follow wherever the radicals take them. Why? Because the radicals use violence (beheadings, etc) to keep the moderates quiet. And guess what, we in the West sit back and let it happen. Jimmy Carter is the perfect example. He "lost" Iran by failing to keep the Shah in power. Carter naively felt Khoemeini was just a "reformer". Carter's foolish belief in applying a "human rights" approach to foreign policy IS the root cause of the current atomic stand off between Iran and the West. Had the Shah been backed by the US and kept in power, we most likely would never had 2 wars with Iraq, Israel wouldn't be facing constant problems from Iranian backed groups like Hamas and Hezbollah, the Soviets probably would never have invaded Afghanistan in 1980, 9-11 wouldn't have happened, and we most certainly wouldn't be sitting on the precipice of Israel attacking Iran withing the coming months. All of this is due to allowing Muslim Fundamentalists to take over in Iran. You want to know the really scary shit, Obama just let the same thing happen in Egypt and Libya.

[essence]

Calm down dear, try to read up a bit on sharia law, this thread and the other one have some links.

On the other hand, continue with your rants, we will just ignore them as ill-informed noise.

[CuteOldGuy]

Sure. We can all read about Sharia law, but in places where it is practiced, the reality doesn't fit the readings. A husband can kill his wife. A family can kill a member who renounces Islam. Women may be disfigured. You steal, you get your hand cut off. Rape a woman, she gets punished. Women can't go outside without covering themselves up completely, and they must be with a male relative. Women typically can't drive, vote, or go to school.

Sure, read all you want about Sharia. But you learn more watching how it is practiced.

[Cpalmson]

Some people are destined to keep their head in the sand and pretend the boogey man doesn't exist. That's fine. But I'm proud to be part of the politically incorrect crowd who is willing to call a spade a spade. I'm sick of those trying to mollify the Muslim religion and their practices. There is too much duplicity going on. The elites will say that we just don't understand them. That is B.S. They try to argue away the definition of Jihad. Their simpleton response is that the term is a nuance and can refer to an "inner" struggle. Pure B.S. Jihad means war against the infidel. So the nuance that Sharia Law can help resolve "low level" disputes is also pure B.S. Sharia Law is a complete system that regulates the entire life of a Muslim. You simply can't pick and choose which aspects you want to practice. It would be like us going to China and telling the Chinese we want to follow the Constitution (but only the 2nd, 5th and 14th Amendments). You can't do that. Radical, Fundamental Islam is a threat to our way of life. Guess what? Sharia Law IS the backbone of the fundamentalist movement. Those trying to mollify the Muslims are the one's creating the "ill-informed noise".

[essence]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Sure. We can all read about Sharia law, but in places where it is practiced, the reality doesn't fit the readings. A husband can kill his wife. A family can kill a member who renounces Islam. Women may be disfigured. You steal, you get your hand cut off. Rape a woman, she gets punished. Women can't go outside without covering themselves up completely, and they must be with a male relative. Women typically can't drive, vote, or go to school.

Sure, read all you want about Sharia. But you learn more watching how it is practiced.

When you have read my link above about Rowan Williams, then I will come back and debate, but until then it is a waste of time. Note what Rowan says about some practices of Sharia. Note what he says about different Muslim understandings of it. Not what he says about its applicability, and whether it should stand alongside laws of the land.

Then, having got the context of the debate, and your frothing has subsided, come back and debate.

Talk about strawmen. Nobody is talking about allowing female mutilation on US soil.

[essence]

ps, if you want counter examples, here is a so called christian (I don't call him that) who is calling for the murder of millions of homosexuals. So stop complaining when a Muslim whacko says the same thing. Religious nuts are nuts.

http://www.wcnc.com/home/Members-sta...152735295.html


I am going through a difficult probate - the lawyer wisely said, don't be afraid of the man in the mask in the middle of the night coming to steal from you, be afraid of your friends and family, they are the ones who are much more likely to steal from you and murder you in your bed.

It is so easy to think of all those demonic foreigner johnnies, when the real danger is at home.

[CuteOldGuy]

Williams is talking about Sharia in the UK. How does that apply here?

Yeah, I saw that video. No one is out saying he has a point and we should adopt his philosophy. No women't rights activists are calling for tolerance for him. He doesn't run a government that endorses the subjugation of women with the means to enforce it.

Big difference there.

[Cpalmson]

I read what Williams said months ago. He's a buffoon. Besides, the UK is now reaping what they have sown. They opened their doors to Muslim immigrants and then failed to assimilate them into British society and culture. They were one of the first countries to embrace the belief in multi-culturalism and diversity. The one thing that made America great in the early 20th Century is that immigrants to this country cast off their home cultures and melted into American society. Unfortunately, our country has taken a hard turn the left when it comes to embracing assimilation. Instead of forcing people to learn English, you have vast parts of America where only Spanish is the language used in the home. That is a shame. What is worse is that policy makers are forcing government agencies to accommodate non-English speakers. That is bull-shit. If you are in America, you should be required to conduct all business in English.

[essence]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Williams is talking about Sharia in the UK. How does that apply here?

The Williams discussion is very similar to what is expressed by sexy in her first post. It supports what sexy posted. It helps an understanding of what Sharia law is actually about, rather than the demonisation. Williams was supported by other senior law officials.

It is the rest of you who are trying to turn this into yet another tirade against Muslims.

Amazing that you have the arrogance to be experts on the situation of Muslims in the UK. I keep telling y'all not to believe what you read in the press, they are liars. I try very hard not to make sweeping judgments on anything going on in the US, but speak purely from personal experience. Don;t always succeed, but I try. On the other hand, Americans will give their two cents about everything going on in the world, didn't you know America is God's own country?

Like I say, it frightens me how hysteria can be whipped up. I seem to recall somebody is currently on trial for crimes against Muslims in Bosnia. 8000 Muslims killed. So how did that little business start, apart from rumours and myths?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...se-Bosnia.html

[CuteOldGuy]

Well, yes. The press are liars. But why should we believe you instead? You quote a nutjob Brit, and then discuss horrors in Bosnia. You've yet to discuss anything about the United States, yet you insist that you are right. So far, all we have is your bluster to rely on. Sorry, need a bit more than that.

Why are you so adamant about accepting Sharia in the US? What's in it for you?

[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by Cpalmson

Some people are destined to keep their head in the sand and pretend the boogey man doesn't exist. That's fine. But I'm proud to be part of the politically incorrect crowd who is willing to call a spade a spade. I'm sick of those trying to mollify the Muslim religion and their practices. There is too much duplicity going on. The elites will say that we just don't understand them. That is B.S. They try to argue away the definition of Jihad. Their simpleton response is that the term is a nuance and can refer to an "inner" struggle. Pure B.S. Jihad means war against the infidel. So the nuance that Sharia Law can help resolve "low level" disputes is also pure B.S. Sharia Law is a complete system that regulates the entire life of a Muslim. You simply can't pick and choose which aspects you want to practice. It would be like us going to China and telling the Chinese we want to follow the Constitution (but only the 2nd, 5th and 14th Amendments). You can't do that. Radical, Fundamental Islam is a threat to our way of life. Guess what? Sharia Law IS the backbone of the fundamentalist movement. Those trying to mollify the Muslims are the one's creating the "ill-informed noise".

The left wants to treat Islam like it's just another religion; it isn't. Even George W Bush participated in the charade by calling Islam a religion of peace. The appeasers of the Jihadists like to say that the terrorists have hijacked a nobel religion and that real Muslims are against terrorism just like all people of good will. A Muslim, practicing his faith according to the Koran and the Hadith essentially has to be Jihadist or a Jihadist supporter.

Muslims have been at war with the non Muslim world (infidels) for fourteen hundred years. What we are seeing today is nothing new. The founding fathers had to deal with the Islamists too. One fifth of the federal budget, under George Washington, went towards paying extortion money to the Barbary pirates. The Barbary pirates were Muslims who kidnapped and enslaved infidels off the coast of northern Africa for several hundred years. This piracy continues today.

The first war America ever fought on foreign soil was against Muslims in 1805.


The Barbary War -- the first American war against Libya -- was the first war waged by the United States outside national boundaries after gaining independence and unification of the country.
The four Barbary States of North Africa - Morocco, Algiers, Tunis, and Tripoli - had plundered seaborne commerce for centuries. Surviving by blackmail, they received great sums of money, ships, and arms yearly from foreign powers in return for allowing the foreigners to [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]trade[/COLOR][/COLOR] in African ports and sail unmolested through the Barbary waters. They demanded tribute money, seized ships, and held crews for ransom or sold them into slavery.

In March 1785, Thomas Jefferson and John Adams went to London to negotiate with Tripoli's envoy, Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdrahaman (or Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja). Upon inquiring "concerning the ground of the pretensions to make war upon nations who had done them no injury", the ambassador replied:

It was written in their Koran, that all nations which had not acknowledged the Prophet were sinners, whom it was the right and duty of the faithful to plunder and enslave; and that every mussulman who was slain in this warfare was sure to go to paradise. He said, also, that the man who was the first to board a vessel had one slave over and above his share, and that when they sprang to the deck of an enemy's ship, every sailor held a dagger in each hand and a third in his mouth; which usually struck such terror into the foe that they cried out for quarter at once. [12]

Our war against Islamic terrorism only seems new because most people don't know history.

Regarding Muslim pirates John Adams wrote:

"We ought not to fight them at all unless we determine to fight them forever," wrote John Adams to Thomas Jefferson in 1786.

More than two hundred years later, John Adam's words have proven to be prophetic


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War

http://www.city-journal.org/html/17_...jefferson.html

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-03-22/o...?_s=PM:OPINION

[essence]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Well, yes. The press are liars. But why should we believe you instead?

I'm not asking anybody to believe me, I just present different viewpoints.

You quote a nutjob Brit,

I don;t think an Archbishop of canterbury, with his qualifications, can be called a nutjob. he has a very academic style, which puts people off, but if you read what he says he is very sensible. Apart from dressing up in frocks.


and then discuss horrors in Bosnia.

It's a good reminder of where frothing about Muslims can lead.


You've yet to discuss anything about the United States, yet you insist that you are right. So far, all we have is your bluster to rely on. Sorry, need a bit more than that.

When did I insist I was right? What more do you need than my stellar reputation as a reliable and honest presenter of facts.

Why are you so adamant about accepting Sharia in the US?

I don;t want wholesale acceptance of sharia law, nothing would anger me more, but an acceptance that sharia law, and jewish equivalents, are already being used in minor matters outside of the scope of the courts is simply accepting reality for what it is.

What's in it for you?


Aboslutely nothing, this is a SHMB, I'm getting messages from my gf, she is desparate for a fuck, she has the biggest tastiest clit ever, I will give it a lick for you

Cheers

[IIFFOFRDB]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

The left wants to treat Islam like it's just another religion; it isn't. Even George W Bush participated in the charade by calling Islam a religion of peace. The appeasers of the Jihadists like to say that the terrorists have hijacked a nobel religion and that real Muslims are against terrorism just like all people of good will. A Muslim, practicing his faith according to the Koran and the Hadith essentially has to be Jihadist or a Jihadist supporter.

Muslims have been at war with the non Muslim world (infidels) for fourteen hundred years. What we are seeing today is nothing new. The founding fathers had to deal with the Islamists too. One fifth of the federal budget, under George Washington, went towards paying extortion money to the Barbary pirates. The Barbary pirates were Muslims who kidnapped and enslaved infidels off the coast of northern Africa for several hundred years. This piracy continues today.

The first war America ever fought on foreign soil was against Muslims in 1805.


The Barbary War -- the first American war against Libya -- was the first war waged by the United States outside national boundaries after gaining independence and unification of the country.
The four Barbary States of North Africa - Morocco, Algiers, Tunis, and Tripoli - had plundered seaborne commerce for centuries. Surviving by blackmail, they received great sums of money, ships, and arms yearly from foreign powers in return for allowing the foreigners to [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]trade[/COLOR][/COLOR] in African ports and sail unmolested through the Barbary waters. They demanded tribute money, seized ships, and held crews for ransom or sold them into slavery.

In March 1785, Thomas Jefferson and John Adams went to London to negotiate with Tripoli's envoy, Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdrahaman (or Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja). Upon inquiring "concerning the ground of the pretensions to make war upon nations who had done them no injury", the ambassador replied:

It was written in their Koran, that all nations which had not acknowledged the Prophet were sinners, whom it was the right and duty of the faithful to plunder and enslave; and that every mussulman who was slain in this warfare was sure to go to paradise. He said, also, that the man who was the first to board a vessel had one slave over and above his share, and that when they sprang to the deck of an enemy's ship, every sailor held a dagger in each hand and a third in his mouth; which usually struck such terror into the foe that they cried out for quarter at once. [12]

Our war against Islamic terrorism only seems new because most people don't know history.

Regarding Muslim pirates John Adams wrote:

"We ought not to fight them at all unless we determine to fight them forever," wrote John Adams to Thomas Jefferson in 1786.

More than two hundred years later, John Adam's words have proven to be prophetic


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Barbary_War

http://www.city-journal.org/html/17_...jefferson.html

http://articles.cnn.com/2011-03-22/o...?_s=PM:OPINION

Learn somthing new everyday. Thanks Joe

[i'va biggen]

[QUOTE=Cpalmson;2738260]First off, Oklahoma passed a law similar to Kansas, and some left wing nut job of a judge ruled the law (which passed by an overwhelming majority of Oklahomans) to be Unconstitutional. That judge needs to go. He's an idiot, liberal, PC, moronic fool.


Not bad I did get one answer .thanks

[Guest030824]

I have gotten to the point that I will not feed the troll.