How are we going to pay for all this shit?

[Captain_Chaos]

Originally Posted by Tiny

So most of this money is supposed to come from people who make more than $1 million a year, and all of it from those who make over $400,000 per year. President Biden has promised people making less than $400,000 per year will not have their tax rates increased.

Biden lied about this and has already backtracked on the $400,000 per person number. It has now changed to $400,000 per COUPLE, and $200,000 per person.

[bambino]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Is he talking about making it where Russia won't participate in the international payments system, where dollars are used to settle transactions? I think the U.S.A. has used that to impose sanctions on Russians and companies that do business with Russia. Or is he talking about taking away the power of the Russian central bank and putting the country on something like the gold standard?

https://mondestuff.com/world-news/pu...led-us-dollar/

[rexdutchman]

Short answer WE ARE, puddens is push NOW corp tax from 21% to 28% and new 21 % global tax and new 15% investment tax on corps by my math that means NEW 43% tax on everything , oh wait not china remember the tariffs , so for us little people prices going up by 43%

[VitaMan]

It's not that complicated. If you make $ 20k per year and have debt of $ 10k, you have a problem. If you make $ 100k a year and have debt of $ 10k, it is not a problem.


The other issue....foreign governments stop buying US debt ? Not a problem either. The US is not Bolivia.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by bambino

Well, we’ve just added 2 trillion more and probably another 2 trillion on top of the 2 trillion last year. Maybe they changed their minds.

Where were you when Trump added almost 8 trillion in 4 short years!

You realize Trump was for all these spending packages.

Nancy held back approval until after Trump was kicked out of office. But bet your ass Trump would have signed any spending bill before the election!

So I'm not really sure wtf YOU think the solution is. Reelecting Trump in 2024?

[nevergaveitathought]

Originally Posted by Tiny

OK, The COVID relief bill just passed will cost 1.9 trillion. Biden has just proposed another 2.2 trillion for Democratic priorities and infrastructure, and reportedly will propose another 2 trillion spending bill in April for more Democratic Party priorities. That adds up to about 6 trillion in round numbers.

Alexandria Ocasio Cortez and Joe Manchin believe the $2.2 trillion just announced is too low. AOC wants it upped to $10 trillion and Manchin wants $4 trillion.

And then there's the Green New Deal, beloved by all the progressive Democratic Politicians. The American Action Forum estimates that would take $51 trillion to $93 trillion over the next ten years.

So most of this money is supposed to come from people who make more than $1 million a year, and all of it from those who make over $400,000 per year. President Biden has promised people making less than $400,000 per year will not have their tax rates increased.

Here's a link to the IRS tax statistics:

https://www.irs.gov/statistics/soi-t...d-gross-income

The latest year available is 2018. In that year, the total taxable income of people making over $1 million per year was $1.6 trillion. If you add the amount of taxable income of people making from $500,000 to a million a year, that goes up to $2.3 trillion.

However, these people are already paying a large % of their income in federal and state income taxes to help pay for existing programs. Let's say 30% of their income to be conservative -- I'm pretty sure it's more than that. That means if you take every dime they make, that they're not already paying in taxes, you end up with $1.1 trillion ($1 million cutoff) or $1.6 trillion ($500,000 cutoff) to pay for all this shit the Democratic Party politicians are proposing.

There's a snowball's chance in hell these politicians can do what they want to do by just taxing the rich.

just a tidbit in the "infrastructure" bill

beside money for bike paths

there's 10 billion for a "civilian climate corp"

but the good news is, they have to supply their own jack boots, rubber truncheons and dress uniform lederhosen

I hear Hollywood is collaborating on an anthem for the corp to sing/chant in their marches, with at least 25% reserved for a rap stanza

[rexdutchman]

At the rate puddens is going its gonna be 100 trillion in 4 years

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

It's not that complicated. If you make $ 20k per year and have debt of $ 10k, you have a problem. If you make $ 100k a year and have debt of $ 10k, it is not a problem.


The other issue....foreign governments stop buying US debt ? Not a problem either. The US is not Bolivia.

The problem is we're worse off than the 20k per year income / 10k debt example. We've got a GDP of $21 trillion and the debt owed by the federal government is $28 trillion. Now the Federal Reserve owns part of this debt, so it's not quite as bad as it sounds. But I bet we're still pretty close to 100% of GDP net of the Fed's holdings.

I've read about a third of it is owned by foreigners. I worry about them jerking it. Bambino's pointed out that Russia is trying to de-dollarize. The Chinese may get piqued and get rid of their dollars. Or maybe people lose confidence and there's a run on the dollar, like what's happened to currencies in a number of developing countries (Argentina, Brazil, Zimbabwe, Venezuela, to note some extreme examples in the last 50 years). It would appear that one way out of this mess would be massive inflation, especially if the U.S. government started issuing more long term debt. Again, LustyLad and CaptainMidnight, the resident experts, would probably take your side on this, so maybe I'm full of shit.

This will give you some perspective on our national debt,

https://www.thebalance.com/national-...events-3306287

And this will show you where we stack up against other countries. I believe the numbers, or at least the USA number, in the table is from 2019. US gross federal government debt has climbed a lot since then, from 106% of GDP to 133% of GDP.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/co...-national-debt

Please note that Singapore is a financial powerhouse, with lots of domestic savings and wealth, kind of like Japan, only its economy is still growing. And the basket cases in the Euro zone like Greece and Italy have sugardaddy Germany to bail them out.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

just a tidbit in the "infrastructure" bill

beside money for bike paths

there's 10 billion for a "civilian climate corp"

but the good news is, they have to supply their own jack boots, rubber truncheons and dress uniform lederhosen

I hear Hollywood is collaborating on an anthem for the corp to sing/chant in their marches, with at least 25% reserved for a rap stanza

It looks to me like it's a lot more Democratic Party politician wish list than infrastructure bill. And that's before they start sticking more pork in the bill so they can keep all the Democratic Representatives and Senators on board.

[Jacuzzme]

Originally Posted by WTF

So I'm not really sure wtf YOU think the solution is. Reelecting Trump in 2024?

That’d be a good start.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by WTF

Where were you when Trump added almost 8 trillion in 4 short years!

You realize Trump was for all these spending packages.

Nancy held back approval until after Trump was kicked out of office. But bet your ass Trump would have signed any spending bill before the election!

Yeah, Trump started out trying to clean up the swamp and instead became part of it. Still, if there weren't an election to win, I couldn't see him trying to pile on another 6 trillion in government spending like Biden.

[nevergaveitathought]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Yeah, Trump started out trying to clean up the swamp and instead became part of it. Still, if there weren't an election to win, I couldn't see him trying to pile on another 6 trillion in government spending like Biden.

trump's infrastructure proposal was like 200 billion

I think the dims criticized trumps as way too much, they weren't going to go for it no matter what

trump's had a public/private mix...I recall blackstone started an infrastructure fund in anticipation,

the total plan was something like 1 trillion with 200 billion from government and the rest from private investment

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

trump's infrastructure proposal was like 200 billion

I think the dims criticized trumps as way too much, they weren't going to go for it no matter what

trump's had a public/private mix...I recall blackstone started an infrastructure fund in anticipation,

the total plan was something like 1 trillion with 200 billion from government and the rest from private investment

I didn't know that. So called public-private partnerships are a common way to pay for infrastructure in many countries. I wouldn't have thought they would have caught on here, because the U.S. politicians, out of arrogance, are reluctant to try anything that's been shown to work in other places. Anyway, it's a good idea, getting the private sector to kick in 80% of the cost.

[bambino]

Originally Posted by Tiny

I didn't know that. So called public-private partnerships are a common way to pay for infrastructure in many countries. I wouldn't have thought they would have caught on here, because the U.S. politicians, out of arrogance, are reluctant to try anything that's been shown to work in other places. Anyway, it's a good idea, getting the private sector to kick in 80% of the cost.

Here’s a link to research government spending:


https://www.usaspending.gov/award/AS...087097202_7300

[nevergaveitathought]

Originally Posted by Tiny

I didn't know that. So called public-private partnerships are a common way to pay for infrastructure in many countries. I wouldn't have thought they would have caught on here, because the U.S. politicians, out of arrogance, are reluctant to try anything that's been shown to work in other places. Anyway, it's a good idea, getting the private sector to kick in 80% of the cost.

well the difference between the dims and trumps proposal besides the left wing twisted things they have in an "infrastructure" bill

(that's the thing about dims, they misuse, abuse and redefine words to fit their schemes because they couldn't accomplish a thing or even get elected if they told the truth)

is that instead of public/private partnerships, its all government control and they just pass tax increases to take what they desire for what would have been the private portion

private? we don't need no stinkin' private