Think for Yourself

[Yssup Rider]

You really are a diamond in the rough, aren't you Cornholio!

Thanks for the heartfelt suggestion.

I have one for you: ESL classes, you ignorant racist fuck.

When you learn how to express yourself, maybe people will understand what you're trying to say. You seem to believe that people understand the predominantly hateful racist gibberish you write and give you credit for understanding it yourself.

Meanwhile, I recommend a visit to the US Holocaust museum in Washington. You can learn all about "percentages of human genetic material" there.

[rioseco]

[QUOTE=Yssup Rider;1056400246]You really are a diamond in the rough, aren't you Cornholio!

Thanks for the heartfelt suggestion.

I have one for you: ESL classes, you ignorant racist fuck.

When you learn how to express yourself, maybe people will understand what you're trying to say. You seem to believe that people understand the predominantly hateful racist gibberish you write and give you credit for understanding it yourself.

Meanwhile, I recommend a visit to the US Holocaust museum in Washington. You can learn all about "percentages of human genetic material" there.[/QUOTE]


You prescribe ESL classes for me, yet call me a racist. That is real irony there. How about you kiss my mixed race ass. You are a racist and a latent homosexual !

[Old-T]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

The Indians (does that term piss you off?) did a few things that were universal. Some of them did believe in land ownership. Maybe not the same as the Europeans like this is Souix land and not this lands belongs to Running Bear but they believe in common ownership and fought wars over it. They also believed in slavery and genocide. It is a myth to think that somehow on the entire planet only in the North American continent did these people live their lives so different with lying or deceit. Like I said...myth.

True, but what does that have to do with whether it is right to have taken their land?

[rioseco]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

The Indians (does that term piss you off?) did a few things that were universal. Some of them did believe in land ownership. Maybe not the same as the Europeans like this is Souix land and not this lands belongs to Running Bear but they believe in common ownership and fought wars over it. They also believed in slavery and genocide. It is a myth to think that somehow on the entire planet only in the North American continent did these people live their lives so different with lying or deceit. Like I said...myth.

Actually no. The use of Indian doesn't anger me.
I would like to be clear on something though. I never intended to imply that the native peoples of the Americas were unique in some sort of saintly manner. They like all people of this world could be deceitful and barbaric and commonly were. Yes they did believe in slavery, and genocide. My point was not to say otherwise. I was addressing the notion of someones claim of socialism paving the way for free land in the Americas. As I said it was achieved thru theft and genocide. You are correct. The same is going on right now elsewhere in the eastern world today.

[JD Barleycorn]

Originally Posted by Old-T

True, but what does that have to do with whether it is right to have taken their land?

It has nothing to do with it but that is not what I was responding to. I am pointing out that some of the Indians had a communal idea of land ownership, individual, not so much. Yeah, we took their land. We stole it and we bought it, we took as spoils of war and we took as part of a treaty, some of it was abandoned and the Americans moved in (We are all Americans despite where our ancestors were born) to what was left. It is the way of humanity and it is not a crime by the Americans. It is a human thing.

[DSK]

Originally Posted by Old-T

Two parts to your statement.

First it depends upon what groups of NAs you are talking about--a nomadic hunter/gatherer group like the Apache or Navajo often were, or a more agrarian group such as the Pueblo people. If I grow crops to feed my family I care very much about that plot of land.

Second, the concept of "private" would not always connect to an INDIVIDUAL, but ofthen to a family, clan, or village. This is true of sacred places, or communal farming lands, or hunting grounds. Just because they did not say, "This acre belongs to John Smith", they may well have the very equally valid concept of "This acre belongs to the Bear clan of the San Juan Pueblo". You had some of this same perspective in the French and Spanish land grants, where some land was given to a family.

I am not quite sure why you seem to think it is morally acceptable to take land from people whether it was held single or by a community. If you believe it was morally right, then you should by the same logic believe that if I have a bigger gun I can morally take your home. It really is the same thing in many cases. (Not all. E.g.: Manhattan)

I think this is a very good reply. It does appear that different groups have differing viewpoints on ownership of the lands, and so my previous statements were too broad and in retrospect seems off the mark.
It would appear that communal land ownership is the most universal concept that must have had wide acceptance, but individual ownership in the Western European model that I'm familiar with was not so prevalent.
Thanks for your reply.

[rioseco]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

It has nothing to do with it but that is not what I was responding to. I am pointing out that some of the Indians had a communal idea of land ownership, individual, not so much. Yeah, we took their land. We stole it and we bought it, we took as spoils of war and we took as part of a treaty, some of it was abandoned and the Americans moved in (We are all Americans despite where our ancestors were born) to what was left. It is the way of humanity and it is not a crime by the Americans. It is a human thing.

I differ in opinion.
I do believe it was a crime,every bit as much as what is going on today by Russias tactics in the Ukraine. Robbing, raping, killing, theft are all human acts. Human acts and crimes.
Just my opinion.

[JD Barleycorn]

I think you misunderstand what I'm saying. I am saying that it is not an American crime to take someone's land. It is a universal concept. The Indians took it from each other and we took it from them through various means. You may hate this, but it was as much of a crime as running over animals on the highway. It's just the way it is and right now we have people trying to take our land.

[rioseco]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

I think you misunderstand what I'm saying. I am saying that it is not an American crime to take someone's land. It is a universal concept. The Indians took it from each other and we took it from them through various means. You may hate this, but it was as much of a crime as running over animals on the highway. It's just the way it is and right now we have people trying to take our land.

I agree, the crime of stealing from others is not unique to any one group.

Tell me something. How is the crime committed against the naturals by Anglo people equated to "running over animals on the highway" ?
I look at that as a highway accident of sorts. I am curious how the two correlate.

Also when you speak of "people trying to take our land" are you refering to the governments abuse of iminent domain laws ? I am not necessarily disagreeing with either statement, I am trying to understand your intent and see how it applies.

[Yssup Rider]

Two words for you Cornholio:

SPELLCHECK!

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

Two words for you Cornholio:

SPELLCHECK!

That would be 'one' word, you Mussulman-luvin, Hitler worshipping, lying, hypocritical, racist, cum-gobbling golem fucktard, HDDB, DEM.

[Yssup Rider]

Really? One word? No shit!

Can't get nothin past you, boy!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

(Laughing... To be clear!)

[IIFFOFRDB]

[JD Barleycorn]

Originally Posted by rioseco

I agree, the crime of stealing from others is not unique to any one group.

Tell me something. How is the crime committed against the naturals by Anglo people equated to "running over animals on the highway" ?
I look at that as a highway accident of sorts. I am curious how the two correlate.

Also when you speak of "people trying to take our land" are you refering to the governments abuse of iminent domain laws ? I am not necessarily disagreeing with either statement, I am trying to understand your intent and see how it applies.

I knew that analogy would tick someone off. What I'm trying to convey is that no group (in this case white Europeans, that is if you call Spaniards white) sit around thinking how they are going to take all the land from indigenous peoples anymore than someone goes out intent on running over a raccoon. It just happens over time. I'm also trying to say that this is not an American failing, this is a universal failing of mankind.

[rioseco]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

Two words for you Cornholio:

SPELLCHECK!

One word for you SpermGut.............Fukewe !