Dick Cheney gets a heart transplant

[pyramider]

I always thought Cheney was a cyborg. Why would a cyborg need a heart?

[Guest123018-4]

I am a walking miracle that would be dead under Obamacare. I am surviving from what was the terminal stage of cancer. To be blessed with additional time is something I wish for all and can only hope the best for him.

[Raa1965]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

At least we now know who the really creepy, pathetic lefties are (like we didn't know). Remember folks, these are the people who claim to be morally superior.

Not at all...just expecting the santimonious right wingers to live by the same rules they want to impose on the rest of the county...

[waverunner234]

Originally Posted by The2Dogs

I am a walking miracle that would be dead under Obamacare. I am surviving from what was the terminal stage of cancer. To be blessed with additional time is something I wish for all and can only hope the best for him.

Obama care is not taking away the current healthcare you have or had, so your post is a complete Lie.

[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by Doove

To speak to the broader point, you've shown yourself as being willing to lie to make a point that benefits your side.



The Democrats can't create a system that already exists.



You're lying again. But even if this were true, how is that any worse than letting young people die because they languish in an inability to afford health care? Or languish without healthcare because they're denied care for a pre-existing condition?

Your problem is that every problem your deluded mind conjures up about Obamacare is, in reality, a problem that already exists. I think they call that a conundrum.

Furthermore, there's nothing in Obamacare that prevents people from paying for any medical treatment they may wish to pay for on their own. So there are no death panels. Which begs the questions, why doesn't your position on Sandra Fluke carry over to the old people that you say Obama wants to let die?

When I wrote that "the Democrats intend to create a system" I'm obviously referencing the fact that Obamacare was passed but has not been fully implemented and has not passed Supreme Court review. Obamacare also has to survive the real danger of being repealed; the majority of Americans are still against it. Consequently, it's a work in progress or being created.

Yes we have problems with the existing health care system. The biggest problem is obviously the cost. Ultimately, not everyone is going to be able to get every procedure; it just costs too much. We have to deal with the cost of health care. I believe that increasing market forces (competition) in the health care system is the key to controlling costs, not eliminating them entirely.

The biggest danger in transitioning to a single payer system is that it gives too much power to the government. In a single payer system, the government has the power of deciding who gets to live and who must die.

If you don't see the danger to freedom of having a government with that level of power, then I don't think I can communicate with you. You may be too blinded by your ideology to see the obvious.

Your habit of constantly calling your opponent a liar is weak tactic. If I have a different interpretation of the facts, that doesn't me a liar. Some issues are complex and almost guarantee that there will be differing opinions between people of good will. Your choice of an avatar may provide a clue about your personality and what causes you write such angry offensive posts. There's a line in the movie "The Dark Knight" spoken by Batman's butler speculating about what motivates the Joker, "some men just want to watch the world burn". Apparently you identifiy with the Joker. I'm not sure you really believe half of what you post; I think you just enjoy attacking people.

[Doove]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

Ultimately, not everyone is going to be able to get every procedure; it just costs too much.

So you were against death panels before you were for them?

We have to deal with the cost of health care. I believe that increasing market forces in the health care system is the key to controlling costs, not eliminating them entirely.

I don't see how we can control health care costs by dealing with or increasing market forces of who pays the bills. The only real way to control costs is to have sway over who's charging the fees. The real answer is government controlled healthcare, but that'll never fly because we're not smart enough.

The biggest danger in transitioning to a single payer system is that it gives too much power to the government. In a single payer system, the government has the power of deciding who gets to live and who must die.

So you'd rather put the decision in the hands of a businessman with a profit motive. I don't see how that's any better.

If you don't see the danger to freedom of having a government with that level of power, then I don't think I can communicate with you. You may be too blinded by your ideology to see the obvious.

There are plenty of other countries filled with people who don't have a problem with the "danger to their freedom" of having a government with that level of power vs. a businessman having that level of power. The fact that you ignore that makes you the obstinate one.

Your habit of constantly calling your opponent a liar is weak tactic.

As to your complaints of referring to someone as a liar, i refer you to post #27 in this very thread.

If I have a different interpretation of the facts, that doesn't me a liar.

I didn't call you a liar solely for having a different interpretation of the facts. I called you a liar for distorting the facts.

I'm not sure you really believe half of what you post; I think you just enjoy attacking people.

Oh, i believe every attack i make. Which isn't to say i don't also enjoy them.

[i'va biggen]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

I don't believe you.

I know facts confuse you.

[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by Doove

So you were against death panels before you were for them?



I don't see how we can control health care costs by dealing with or increasing market forces of who pays the bills. The only real way to control costs is to have sway over who's charging the fees. The real answer is government controlled healthcare, but that'll never fly because we're not smart enough.



So you'd rather put the decision in the hands of a businessman with a profit motive. I don't see how that's any better.



There are plenty of other countries filled with people who don't have a problem with the "danger to their freedom" of having a government with that level of power vs. a businessman having that level of power. The fact that you ignore that makes you the obstinate one.



As to your complaints of referring to someone as a liar, i refer you to post #27 in this very thread.



I didn't call you a liar solely for having a different interpretation of the facts. I called you a liar for distorting the facts.



Oh, i believe every attack i make. Which isn't to say i don't also enjoy them.

You say that you can't see how having a businessman with a profit motive be the provider of health care is any better than having the government do it. It is precisely the profit motive that serves to contol cost, which is the core problem with health care. The profit motive rewards the health care provider for being efficient and eliminating waste. The government doesn't care about the cost of anything. The CBO estimated cost of Obamacare has already been revised upward from 940 billion to 1.76 trillion.

America's private health care system has been dramatically superior to every other health care system in the world in making advances in imaging technology (MRI, CAT scans) arthrorscopic technology, pharmaceuticals, surgical procedures, vaccines, etc. In every aspect of advancing the science of medicine, America has been the clear leader for decades. It has been the leader precisely because the system has allowed for the pursuit of profit. The entire world has benefited from America's medical advances. In effect America has paid the cost for research and development for the rest the world.

Now the socialists want to abandon a system, that although imperfect, is still the leader of the world in providing state of the art health care. If you have cancer in Houston, you go to the MD Anderson Clinic in the Houston Medical Center, you don't get on a plane and fly to Canada or Europe. Every day people from all over the world do come to America for health care because they know our private sector system run by businessmen with a profit motive provides the best health care in the world.

[CJ7]

the 100,00 people who went to hospitals for medical procedures, and died from unrelated mystery infections might just disagree about the quality of our healthcare.

I could tell you some personal shit that involved my Mom and her light stroke that would make you want to look for a witch doctor rather than a hospital

[CJ7]

Originally Posted by The2Dogs

I am a walking miracle that would be dead under Obamacare. I am surviving from what was the terminal stage of cancer. To be blessed with additional time is something I wish for all and can only hope the best for him.

good for you ... STAY well.. I mean that.


youre full of crap if you think the healthcare law changed your existing insurance policy

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by The2Dogs

I am a walking miracle that would be dead under Obamacare. I am surviving from what was the terminal stage of cancer. To be blessed with additional time is something I wish for all and can only hope the best for him.

It seems to me that it would be nearly impossible to accurately predict that you "would be dead under Obamacare." But, if it makes you feel better to make the claim, go for it!

In any event, I am thrilled that you are a "terminal stage" cancer survivor. "Additional time" is a good thing. Make that a very good thing!

Way to go 2Dogs!

[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by CJ7

the 100,00 people who went to hospitals for medical procedures, and died from unrelated mystery infections might just disagree about the quality of our healthcare.

I could tell you some personal shit that involved my Mom and her light stroke that would make you want to look for a witch doctor rather than a hospital

I've read some of the stuff about infections people get in hospitals and death from medical mistakes. It is pretty bad. I just think it's going to be a whole lot worse if the government takes over.

Does anybody think that public (government) schools are better than private schools? Why should we believe that health care quality will improve by letting the government take over?

[CJ7]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

I've read some of the stuff about infections people get in hospitals and death from medical mistakes. It is pretty bad. I just think it's going to be a whole lot worse if the government takes over.

Does anybody think that public (government) schools are better than private schools? Why should we believe that health care quality will improve by letting the government take over?

the government runs the VA hospitals, the vets have a high praise for them best I can tell .. very little mentioned about deaths from foreign infections at VA's ...

the private sector proves they cant control prices and keep healthcare affordable and paying maximum $$$ doesnt mean youre immune to an unrelated death

[CJ7]

IMPROVE?

lets just say the quality remains the same, and the cost of seeing your insurance company on TV commercials, and administrative costs, executive salaries etc etc no longer exist, and people can actually AFFORD healthcare.

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by CJ7

the government runs the VA hospitals, the vets have a high praise for them best I can tell .. very little mentioned about deaths from foreign infections at VA's ...

the private sector proves they cant control prices and keep healthcare affordable and paying maximum $$$ doesnt mean youre immune to an unrelated death

He might have a difficult time convincing people that the Fort Sam Hospital in San Antonio gives anything less than the very best medical treatment.