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CJ7 · 01-08-2013, 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

The FairTax has been studied and is designed to be revenue neutral. It also requires the repeal of the 16th Amendment. So we will have to cut spending regardless of the tax system. Overall, the FairTax is our best chance to reinvigorate the economy and keep Congress in check.

www.fairtax.org

counter

http://fairtaxfraud.com/fair.asp

Texas Contrarian · 01-08-2013, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

As the opening statement of the thread clearly states...." expiration of the reduction in the payroll tax rate." Everyone's taxes went up; even those of the middle class.

I know it can be difficult at times for poorly informed simpletons to keep up, but what is it about the word "temporary" that you don't understand? The measure was intended to be temporary, remember? In other words, lower income groups got a rather large 2-year-long break. I think it was a poorly thought out policy, but it's what we got.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

The FairTax has been studied and is designed to be revenue neutral. It also requires the repeal of the 16th Amendment. So we will have to cut spending regardless of the tax system. Overall, the FairTax is our best chance to reinvigorate the economy and keep Congress in check.

Yes, it's plainly the case that we'll have to dramatically cut spending in any event (and/or or dramatically rasie taxes, which will put the kibosh on any chance for robust economic growth any time soon) -- but that's where we are. However, enacting the FairTax and eliminating the income tax is just a fantasy. There's not the slightest chance it will ever happen.

Whirlaway · 01-08-2013, 02:20 PM

"Temporary" label has NOTHING to do with who is responsible for the increase. The increase happened under Obama's watch.

Obama boasted he "cut middle class taxes" when he authorized the temporary cuts; so isn't it fair to also now say he raised taxes ?

"Now, I’ve cut taxes for those who need it – middle-class families and small businesses. But I don’t believe that another round of tax breaks for millionaires will bring good jobs to our shores, or pay down our deficit," Obama said.

If Obama wants credit for the cuts, he should get the blame for the increase. The cuts were temporary as well.

BTW, the cuts were a terrible idea and added billions to our deficit.

CJ7 · 01-08-2013, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

"Temporary" label has NOTHING to do with who is responsible for the increase. The increase happened under Obama's watch.

Obama boasted he "cut middle class tax cuts" when he authorized the temporary cuts; so isn't it fair to also now say he raised taxes ?

If Obama wants credit for the cuts, he should get the blame for the increase.

BTW, the cuts were a terrible idea and added billions to our deficit.

then the tax cuts passed by the republicans in 01 02 are in fact being increased by them and them alone ... had Obama or anyone else for that matter stood aside and done absolutely nothing, the tax cuts would have increased all by themselves just like the republican legislation and the LAW required them to do ..

Texas Contrarian · 01-08-2013, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

"Temporary" label has NOTHING to do with who is responsible for the increase. The increase happened under Obama's watch.

[sigh]

Go ahead and ignore everything else that's undoubtedly obvious to just about everyone reading this thread, and revel in your ignorance and disingenuity.

By the way, have you considered a run for Congress? You seem qualified!

Whirlaway · 01-08-2013, 02:37 PM

(Dramatic Sigh...drama queen)

So did Obama "cut" taxes when he authorized the temporary "tax cut" that was part of the stimulus bill?

CJ7 · 01-08-2013, 02:48 PM

theres an old C&W song that was named just for you whirlie

Hello Wall.

CuteOldGuy · 01-08-2013, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainMidnight

Yes, it's plainly the case that we'll have to dramatically cut spending in any event (and/or or dramatically rasie taxes, which will put the kibosh on any chance for robust economic growth any time soon) -- but that's where we are. However, enacting the FairTax and eliminating the income tax is just a fantasy. There's not the slightest chance it will ever happen.

Yes, I know that. But it is still the best alternative out there. Politicians get too much political leverage from promoting class warfare. The FairTax would eliminate that, so it is a non-starter. This is partly the reason I don't, and will probably never trust this government. They are only about obtaining and retaining power. If they truly cared about the people, they would do away with this monstrous abuse of power.

Texas Contrarian · 01-08-2013, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

So did Obama "cut" taxes when he authorized the temporary "tax cut" that was part of the stimulus bill?

The 2009 "stimulus" bill was really just an ill-considered collection of gimmicks and political payoffs to favored constituencies. That's why it didn't do much to boost the nation's prosperity. And it's true of the "tax cuts" as well as all of the other elements of the ARRA.

A better way to look at this issue is to go back four years and consider the net effect of everything that's transpired during that period. If something happens and then "unhappens," you might reflexively assume that the net effect is the same as if it didn't happen in the first place. But that may or may not be the case, depending on the event.

For instance, in the case of a temporary tax rate change that ends up being rescinded, some money is going to end up other than where it would have been absent the policy change. But how much was extracted from lower-income taxpayers' accounts during the past four years relative to what would have been the case absent any policy changes, and at what rate are those taxpayers paying tax today relative to four years ago? Everything else is just noise.

If you were to argue that the policies pursued by Obama (as well as his predecessor and many who have served in congress) will necessitate a large tax increase on the middle class at some unknown future time, you would be on much more solid ground. But that's not what you've been arguing, is it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

...Politicians get too much political leverage from promoting class warfare. The FairTax would eliminate that, so it is a non-starter. This is partly the reason I don't, and will probably never trust this government. They are only about obtaining and retaining power. If they truly cared about the people, they would do away with this monstrous abuse of power.

Geez...are you trying to prohibit these people from having any fun?

A policy idea will never go anywhere if it removes from political hacks the opportunity of engaging in political hackery!

Yssup Rider · 01-08-2013, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Yes, I know that. But it is still the best alternative out there. Politicians get too much political leverage from promoting class warfare. The FairTax would eliminate that, so it is a non-starter. This is partly the reason I don't, and will probably never trust this government. They are only about obtaining and retaining power. If they truly cared about the people, they would do away with this monstrous abuse of power.

that's bullshit.

WTF · 01-08-2013, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaptainMidnight

If you were to argue that the policies pursued by Obama (as well as his predecessor and many who have served in congress) will necessitate a large tax increase on the middle class at some unknown future time, you would be on much more solid ground. But that's not what you've been arguing, is it?

!

Bingo. It is coming but it really is not the politicians fault. The public keeps wanting more shit and lower taxes. The market at some point will correct it for them. Then they will have to do a Jimmy Carter!

Yssup Rider · 01-08-2013, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

So you have no proof that it was edited.

I don't watch TV. I don't even have TV. I get my news from the WSJ and the NYT.

well if you haven't seen it, then why are you flapping your yap?

Yssup Rider · 01-08-2013, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Do you honestly believe the interview WAS edited, Assup? Prove it. Or again be shown to be the ignorant liar that you are.

You're an asshole, and that's no lie! Prove me wrong! what a dickhead!

Yssup Rider · 01-08-2013, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Do you honestly believe the interview WAS edited, Assup? Prove it. Or again be shown to be the ignorant liar that you are.

You're an asshole, and that's no lie! Prove me wrong! what a dickhead!

Ofmcourse,my ours in Kansas, so no sheep is safe tonight! Not to mention transients in the Salina bus depot!