The Death of Modern Liberal Feminism (And its Rebirth in the Conservative Movement)

[pjorourke]

Women are much more condescending towards other women that most guys would ever dream of being.

[Marshall]

Originally Posted by Marcus Aurelius

And it was really hilarious when Palin said that there are 57 states. LMAO.




Oh wait. My mistake, that was Obama. NM.

WHAT DID NINA SAY?!? WHAT DID SHE SAY!? I don't speak Austrian......




You’re telling me …
In Strasbourg, France, Barack Obama told the audience that he doesn’t know what the term for ‘wheeling and dealing’ is in “Austrian” — watch the video here.

[Marshall]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

I thought feminism was letting the lady get on top.

You need to read the "Fuckin' Fuck Me" Thread..........Ansley doesn't need to be that disappointed......

[Mazomaniac]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

Women are much more condescending towards other women that most guys would ever dream of being.

That's because women are significantly less likely to slap another woman than they are a man.

Professional courtesy and all ya know . . . .

[Guest050715-1]

I don't know about intellectual and varying kinds of feminism. Feminism is about leveling the playing field: for equal work; freedom from domestic violence; freedom from harassment in the work place; freedom from having our husbands or fathers legally make decisions for us. In short, it is about women being equal financially and under the law and.

It is not about taxes, emasculating men or sexuality as others have suggested. Suggesting so in my mind trivializes the struggle of so many women that have come before us. Suffragettes were thrown in prison and then force fed when they went on a hunger strike. Women working during WW II glorified by the Rossy the Rivittor campaign were fired when the men returned home from the war. As late as the990's a woman was denied a name change to her maiden name during a divorce proceeding because the judge didn't think it proper for a woman to have a different last name than her child. He said it might be perceived that the child was illegitimate.

[Marshall]

Originally Posted by Mazomaniac

That's because women are significantly less likely to slap another woman than they are a man.

Ahhhh....the voice of experience.....Maniac will tell you that men are pigs...he knows......

[WTF]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

Women are much more condescending towards other women that most guys would ever dream of being.

Oh we dream to....our weiners just won't let us for fear of reprisal!

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

I don't know about intellectual and varying kinds of feminism. Feminism is about leveling the playing field: for equal work; freedom from domestic violence; freedom from harassment in the work place; freedom from having our husbands or fathers legally make decisions for us. In short, it is about women being equal financially and under the law and.

Hi Olivia;
there are various movements in feminism. Details on how pornography and sex work is viewed by feminists for example vary in different movements. Some feminist strains see it as bad and supportive of patriarchy, while sex positive feminism sees it as ok and empowerment for women`s independence. Just one example.

Others are differetiated by strains of thought and philosophical back grounds.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex-positive_feminism

here is an wiki entrance on the oppositions and contradictions of the various movements called "the feminist sex wars"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feminist_Sex_Wars

[Can I Play Too???]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

I don't know about intellectual and varying kinds of feminism. Feminism is about leveling the playing field: for equal work; freedom from domestic violence; freedom from harassment in the work place; freedom from having our husbands or fathers legally make decisions for us. In short, it is about women being equal financially and under the law and.

It is not about taxes, emasculating men or sexuality as others have suggested. Suggesting so in my mind trivializes the struggle of so many women that have come before us. Suffragettes were thrown in prison and then force fed when they went on a hunger strike. Women working during WW II glorified by the Rossy the Rivittor campaign were fired when the men returned home from the war. As late as the990's a woman was denied a name change to her maiden name during a divorce proceeding because the judge didn't think it proper for a woman to have a different last name than her child. He said it might be perceived that the child was illegitimate.

Like Nina said, there was more than one period in time for women's lib. Owning property and voting are excluded from my point because it also applies to men who are "colored" (as they were called in those days). Not sure where the other Equal Rights that you have listed and, somehow, taken from a history of some other place. You completely left out the 60's and Feminine Mystique and the like but I see you are not informed of that part of US history.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Can I Play Too???

It's about debasing the feminine Principle/essence in favor of masculine traits and emasculating the males. (Battle of the Sexes, anyone) . More eugenics posts from Mashall, I see.

At some point feminism can be like that. Especially the earlier waves have been like that. Nowadays you don`t see that anymore. Women are - yet again - wearing stillettoes, shaving their armpits and being submissive to male ideals while pretending to be all emanzipated ..... I also do agree that it widens the gap between men and women but for different reasons than you do. Some feminist strains are guilty of stereotyping males and females as opposites , much in the same way patriarchy does. The battle of the sexes was started by patriarchy , feminist movement has brought it to the top but not offered really many solutions except that women now are the better males (or the new "soft leaders" which is the same gap like before was - just with women on top and men on bottom) I think Gender equality is a term that would be more of what you would describe as anti - battle of the sexes.
Or Queer theories. I personally would not say i am a feminist because its so exclusionary of males and "seing it all the female way" is just suppressing men. I can relate to sex positive feminism though. But i am not a hypocrite , a woman having sugardaddies and then claiming to be a feminist is kind of - well..... lalalalalalala......although many young hipsters do that.

I`ve seen too many "feminists" that have been submissive to men catering to their ideals rather than standing up for themselves, that i believe its really hard to encounter true feminists out there. I might be jaded, and i am sure they do exist. But so many women label themselves as feminists betraying the core of that movement which is "emancipation" that i just mainly roll my eyes for that.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

Women are much more condescending towards other women that most guys would ever dream of being.

yes that`s because in wild wild west men just took a duell without much words. and women were socialised to pull hair and scream.

[Katerina]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

All right, all right, to amuse Charles and myself, I'll take the bait. Are you implying...................... .............that the Pro-Life movement via Sarah Palin and Sharia law derailed the American feminist movement?

Sorry to tell you this, but feminism is here to stay. Feminism isn't "Femi-Natzies" like Rush calls us. Feminism is about the empowerment of women.

Did it ever occur to you that if feminists had our way, we'd be doling out birth control in multiple forms so abortions would become a non-issue for the most part? Feminism isn't about reproduction. I don't care what neo-con propaganda is trying to force feed it's zealots.

Before you declare the feminist movement dead, consider first the emergence and growth of the third wave of feminism...."Also considered part of the third wave is sex-positivity, a celebration of sexuality as (GASP, Conservatives!) a positive aspect of life, with broader definitions of what sex means and what oppression and empowerment may imply in the context of sex. For example, many third-wave feminists have reconsidered opposition to pornography and to sex work of the second wave, and challenge existing beliefs that participants in pornography and in sex work cannot be empowered. [Johnson, Merri Lisa, ed (2002). Jane Sexes It Up: True Confessions of Feminist Desire. New York: Four Walls Eight Windows. ISBN 9781568581804. OCLC 49515674]

Olivia, you seem to be one of the empowered ones, so my commendations regarding your commentary.

Guerrilla warfare...bang, bang! It's on! Go get 'em gals! In your heels and pearls, of course!

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Katerina

Before you declare the feminist movement dead, consider first the emergence and growth of the third wave of feminism...."Also considered part of the third wave is sex-positivity, a celebration of sexuality as (GASP, Conservatives!) a positive aspect of life, with broader definitions of what sex means and what oppression and empowerment may imply in the context of sex. For example, many third-wave feminists have reconsidered opposition to pornography and to sex work of the second wave, and challenge existing beliefs that participants in pornography and in sex work cannot be empowered. [Johnson, Merri Lisa, ed (2002). Jane Sexes It Up: True Confessions of Feminist Desire. New York: Four Walls Eight Windows. ISBN 9781568581804. OCLC 49515674]

Olivia, you seem to be one of the empowered ones, so my commendations regarding your commentary.

Guerrilla warfare...bang, bang! It's on! Go get 'em gals! In your heels and pearls, of course!

heres a great book "Whores and other Feminists" by Jill Nagle

http://www.amazon.com/Whores-Other-F.../dp/0415918227

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

Women are much more condescending towards other women that most guys would ever dream of being.

on a more serious note: guys are the same way about other guys. I think its because we are the same species. If a guy is condescending towards a woman he is being labeled easy as misogynist. Same with a woman being like that to men. Called castrating dyke. A woman criticising a woman is much more of a fair game. I am a woman myself so i allow myself to criticise women.

[Whirlaway]

Feminism = leveling the playing field?

Then feminism is dead; because the field is pretty damn level.

Except in those countries which keep women in burques and such.