IMF Boss Dominique Strauss Kahn alleged hotel rape

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

Not saying it can't be done ..... but it would be incredibly hard to keep it quiet.

I agree with you. But - such things can be done and are done. The other question is - if it was NOT a set up (to ask the counter question to yours ;.-)...) how come he could not have prevented the woman to shut it?
(Again, not saying its ethical and its politically correct, i am talking about male pragmatism here)

Remember the woman in Lybia who got raped and went into a hotel room completely damaged and was "put away". No one has heard of her ever since.
Strictly spoken - how many women get raped and abused and NO ONE ever talks about it. Or it will be in the medias.
So i think its about 50: 50 it was a set up and he participated. He moight have made it easy.

I also find the Julian Assange rape case a bit strange, kinda similar.

Then the ROman polanski case.

I do like the USA approach towards such things though. He He . They are more female centered IF she was raped. In europe -

and i know that for sure ( and i am sure it happens in the USA too) when an escort gets raped from a high profile client no police will file a report. Its standard procedure. Ok maid was not an escort, but latest when his name could have come out, measurements would have bveen taken.

SO again - consider him a prick and a chauvinist and a typical male macho (well oh he had sex with some subordinate of him - i mean how outrageous (haha) i can tell it happens a lot in any business so its not so special to him. I know of escorts who get hired by clients for free fucks in their company. So - i mean he does not really anything different.)

the case of the reporter could be fishy easily. The case of the NYC maid. It can be true, but i doubt it. Or its half true or whatnot. But its interesting to lead that discussion, i love to value all points.

Peoole have achilles heels and if you know where they are because you know them profoundly, a set up like this might have been easy.
People are vulnerable. Men especially. To accuse a man of rape is pretty easy. The proof not so much.
Again . i am discussing options here. I am not saying he was set up or defending him. Its just from all i know it sounds unlikely. Just a wild guess so tp speak.

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

First thing that makes me suspicious: A hotel maid is not allowed to clean up a room when the guest is inside. WE all know that.

It always cracks me up when people on this Board make blanket, absolute statements that from my own personal experience I know to be inaccurate......:jawd rop::jawdrop :

There may be some hotels with that policy but it certainly isn't universal. On many occasions I've had housekeeping (I believe that to be the P.C. term most hotels use these days) clean around me, often while I'm using the room as an office and trying to get some work done. If I'm on a call or going to be on a call I usually ask her not to bother to vacuum (I mean seriously, a room can survive a day without vacuuming) Never seemed to be a problem.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

It always cracks me up when people on this Board make blanket, absolute statements that from my own personal experience I know to be inaccurate......:jawd rop::jawdrop :

There may be some hotels with that policy but it certainly isn't universal. On many occasions I've had housekeeping (I believe that to be the P.C. term most hotels use these days) clean around me, often while I'm using the room as an office and trying to get some work done. If I'm on a call or going to be on a call I usually ask her not to bother to vacuum (I mean seriously, a room can survive a day without vacuuming) Never seemed to be a problem.

Oh come on, you`re such a meanie
I am a rationalist and not a psychic

(and i told you not to tell anyone about Elvis... damn it .... .... ;.) )

Yes you are right with the roomkeeping, i agree that was a broad statement and a generalization that is not necessarily true. I usually ask HK to do everything around me (not me ;-).... ) as well, but you have to specifically ask them as they usually (IMHO) leave the room when they hear someone is there. But you are right.

[NinaBrooke]

Well now that the FRENCH believe its a conspiracy i might be inclined to believe its true ;-))). And since i found he is an attorney i tend to believe its even more true (just kidding) Maybe he had a god complex :-)

Here is an interesting article mentioning all pros and cons for conspiracy. I don`t like the fact that some french don`t even consider that this could be true.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13443085

Strauss-Kahn arrest: Maid 'scared but will testify'


The maid who has accused International Monetary Fund (IMF) head Dominique Strauss-Kahn of sexual assault is "scared" but will testify against him, her lawyer says.

Jeffrey Shapiro says when the 32-year-old woman discovered Mr Strauss-Kahn's identity a day after the incident she feared for herself and her daughter.

He said there was "nothing consensual about what took place in that hotel room" in New York on 14 May.

Mr Strauss-Kahn denies all the charges.

They are committing a criminal sexual act, attempted rape, sexual abuse, unlawful imprisonment and forcible touching.

Mr Strauss-Kahn, 62, is currently on suicide watch at New York's infamous Rikers Island prison.

His lawyers have said they will ask again for bail at a court hearing on Thursday.

His wife, former French television interviewer Anne Sinclair, is thought to be visiting him in the next two days.

Police on Wednesday removed a piece of carpet from the Sofitel Hotel, where the incident allegedly took place, for forensic tests.

'Man of great power'
Mr Shapiro told NBC television that his client was expected to testify before a grand jury later on Wednesday.

Continue reading the main story
Strauss-Kahn allegations
2006: Publication of Sexus Politicus, book by Christophe Deloire and Christophe Dubois, with chapter on Mr Strauss-Kahn and his tendency to "seduction to the point of obsession"
2007: French journalist Jean Quatremer, Brussels correspondent for Liberation, writes on his blog that Mr Strauss-Kahn "verges on harassment" with his behaviour towards women
2008: Mr Strauss-Kahn admits an affair with a colleague at the IMF; he is cleared of abuse but admits an "error of judgement"
2011: Writer Tristane Banon comes forward to say Mr Strauss-Kahn tried to assault her in 2002; she did not go to the police but did raise the allegation in a TV chat show in 2007, when Mr Strauss-Kahn's name was bleeped out
Is Strauss-Kahn haunted by Polanski?
He said she had only become aware of Mr Strauss-Kahn's identity "a day later when a friend called her to tell her, 'do you have any idea who this man is who did this to you?'".

Mr Shapiro said his client was "scared and incredulous".

"When she found out this encounter was with a man of great power and wealth she feared not only for herself but more importantly for her daughter."

The woman had now been reunited with her 15-year-old daughter in a "safe place", he added.

Mr Shapiro said she had tried to return to her home - a sub-let flat in the Bronx - but had found about 30 people waiting outside.

He said: "She has been in a whirlwind since this has taken place... She has not had a moment of peace, has not been able to return home or seek help.

"She doesn't know what her future will bring."

The woman came originally from the West African state of Guinea. She arrived in the US seven years ago with her daughter and had been in her job at the Sofitel hotel for three years.

Mr Strauss-Kahn's lawyer, Benjamin Brafman, said on Monday that the defence believe the forensic evidence "will not be consistent with a forcible encounter".



Click to play

Lawyer Jeffrey Shapiro: "She had no idea who this man was when she went into the room"
But Mr Shapiro said that "when a jury hears her testimony and sees her in person" it would become clear that "there is nothing consensual about what took place in that hotel room".

He said that his client had "no agenda" and believed it was her responsibility to follow the judicial process "and she will do that".

On Wednesday, detectives removed a section of carpet from the penthouse suite in search of evidence to support her allegation she was forced into an act of oral sex.

Support in France
Public opinion in France appears to be largely on the side of Mr Strauss-Kahn, who until his arrest was considered one of the leading candidates for the French presidential election next year.

An opinion poll for RMC radio, BDM television and the 20Minutes website found 57% of those who replied believed Mr Strauss-Kahn was the victim of a conspiracy.

That number rose to 70% among those who identified themselves as favouring Mr Strauss-Kahn's centre-left Socialist Party.


Mr Strauss-Kahn is on suicide watch at Rikers Island prison
The philosopher Bernard-Henri Levy, a friend of Mr Strauss-Kahn for 25 years, has spoken out in his defence.

"Nothing in the world can authorise the way this man has been thrown to the dogs," he wrote on his blog.

"I do not know... how a chambermaid could enter on her own the room of one of the most watched people on the planet, against the normal practice in most big New York hotels, which provide for 'cleaning brigades' of at least two people."

But Mr Shapiro said: "The idea that someone would suggest she was involved in some form of conspiracy is ridiculous."

Meanwhile, US Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner said Mr Strauss-Kahn was not in a position to run the IMF and an interim replacement should be named.

Since Mr Strauss-Kahn's arrest last Saturday, his deputy John Lipsky has been serving as acting managing director.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13443085

[gnadfly]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

darling, also americans do such things,they just don`t officially flirt/fuck with women like europeans do. That is all. No difference there. Its just handled differently if a man in europe is married and has a mistress than its in USA. So you americans are not the "better" people nbecause you keep your exploits relatively private and don`t visit BROTHELS for discussion of business matters like europeans do. (lol)

i already pointed out why i thought a set up is possible in my first post. Its a monetary issue.

I think though that the americans have their revenge now regarding the non extradition of Roman Polanski (which i do find outrageous) so they were strict with him (no bail) because they know the french don?t extradict.

....

??? I think we are talking rape, not some consensual extramaritial affair. Does the Euro press cover rape up too? Let me get this straight, you are saying the maid and the maid alone set the IMF chief up for money?

The whole Polanski association is just sickening. Polanski was offered a sweet deal considering the charges he was up against and bolted the country. Then he continues to portray the Americans as repressed and the American court system as barbaric. If he had done what he did in Texas, he'd be doing at least 10 years in Huntsville. Cry me a river.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

??? I think we are talking rape, not some consensual extramaritial affair. Does the Euro press cover rape up too? Let me get this straight, you are saying the maid and the maid alone set the IMF chief up for money?

The whole Polanski association is just sickening. Polanski was offered a sweet deal considering the charges he was up against and bolted the country. Then he continues to portray the Americans as repressed and the American court system as barbaric. If he had done what he did in Texas, he'd be doing at least 10 years in Huntsville. Cry me a river.

You did not understand what i was writing with Polanski. I think its OUTRAGEOUS he did NOT get extradited and the french politics is covering him. I do find it disgusting he did not see an french prison, too.

I do find that sickening and disgusting and - chauvinist - and the USA is RIGHT with not putting someone that is A FRENCH citizen on bail because of the flight risk. That is what i was saying. I never watched a single Polanski movie out of protest against that guy. But i remember US- Hollywoodstars also covering for Polanski , so that is not something particularly EURO. I don`t understand why you would attack euros for covering more shit up than USA (or other countries). DO you believe in fairness? Unfortunately i don`t. People in power most often get treated differently no matter if they are USA or somewhere else.

The Euro press does not cover rape up anymore like any other press in the other world does. You were talking about another "euro" getting his trash on as something that just specifically happens to euros. That is what i countered. Europe is more sexually open minded when it comes to many things, but it does not condone that people get raped, and i was thinking you talked about "euros" because of that sexual openness, and men having mistresses officially. And so i assumed your logical conclusion to being a "euro" sexually must be to get someone raped (in the USA preferably). That is what i was countering with my argument. I am sorry if that was misunderstood.

Also the american law system has its flaws, so don`t be so sure about your system working so much better. I have to say when it comes to crimes like "assaulting women" ( i am not talking rape here, it begins much earlier) the USA has the better system of following up on that agendas.
But other than that i don`t agree that the USA law system is so much better, it also has its flaws, americans just cover up different .

I have to admit i was not aware that guy already had a history of sexual assaults when i first read that story. That give the thing a different light. I have to admit now that i feel ashamed of thinking of a cover up, but i am glad we have that discussion. I thought it was the only sexual assault he had. I was wrong. I had not researched properly. My bad. AND I DEFINETELY DO NOT CHIME IN WITH THE FRENCH PUBLIC OPINIOS - that is gross... I am sorry if i came across that way. I was suggesting different points of views but some french medias portray the incident in a way that it can`t possibly have happened that guy raped her. That is not my opinion. I am thinking both ways. I just like to think in many different ways and directions. If that woman was raped - all justice to her, and he needs to rot in jail for that.

as to the monetary issue, why i was first thinking of a set up because of the coincidence:
He is the BOss of IMF and it was about funding countries like portugal, greece and others, that was my suggestion. Now these funds are significantly shortened. given that "coincidence" i thought of a set up.

I assume the maid would have gotten more money if she shut up, so the though of her setting him up alone would not have crossed my mind. My god :-). I was making parallels with the Julian Assange case of the rape, which could have been a politically followed agenda to get a hold of him. I am inclined to think that i was wrong though.

Now with the new information i have i an inclined to think he might as well have done it, but someone was inclined to make it public asap and it might as well have politically played into someone s hands like the Berlusconi affair. I think people with the power of these guys can cover up (and will do so) if they please. No matter if rape or not. And no matter if it happens in the USA or elsewhere. I think you are a bit naive in underestimating the power of wealth and the power of connections people have.
Cover ups happen as well in the USA and in Europe and elsewhere. Rape or not.

I am although happy he was caught in the USA and not in Europe with this act :-). If he did it , he deserves that. SOme laws are better in USA than in Europe. When it comes to sexually assaulting people that is. In the France i am sure he would have made his influence obvious. Just my opinion.

[discreetgent]

re: Polanski

The Swiss also refused to extradite him.

re: Tristane Banon

She came forward with accusations back in 2002, she did not wait until now to come forward.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

re: Polanski

The Swiss also refused to extradite him.

re: Tristane Banon

She came forward with accusations back in 2002, she did not wait until now to come forward.

He did not need to be extradited, that is not the point, (although i would have extradited him), a simple prison sentence would have done it in my opinion. The case could have been trialed also in france, since rape is, also in france, a crime (although i don`t believe that so much anymore after all these incidents - Specially Polanski lived a life dating "extremely young" women back in france then - its hard to believe there were no underaged anymore - The "good" thing about people is that they are indeed predictable to a certain extent, which should make it easier to process them).

I don`t understand why not even this has happened. Some countries do , some don`t have agreements of extradition. That is not the problem: the Problem is WHY oh WHY was Mr. Polanski never put in trial in FRANCE? That is outrageous.

Other question: what would have happened IF mr. Kahn made it to france before police captured him? Would the french also NOT trialed him? That is also an interesting point to discuss here.

Tristane Banone came forward with her accusations but then refused and agreed with her "attorney" not to press charges back in 2002. Why? What i was pointing out is that NOW she is pressing charges and before she didn`t. So? In my eyes she is doing politics here. So i am asking, who paid her to not press charges and who did so now to make her talk? She is in my eyes "someone that sails with the wind" so to speak. Not reliable.
speaking of which makes me think that its partially her fault as well that the guy went free and did these things to another woman. Being a victim is one thing. Making politics another.
A person that gets raped and does not press charges is supporting what has happened to her. So she basically gave him a "free pass".

And i am not talking "out of the blue" here, i have myself pressed charges against people who abused me (together with my sister). So i *know*. And these people were family. Turmoils tend to be different when you process against a stranger with money :-).
So, A person who presses charges 9 years later is definetely doing politics and not "outraged" about a sexual abuse. She could have prevented it to other people happening. She *knew*.


Other than that, i agree that guy should be processed and trialed in the USA. Never let him to France. Interesting if the french would have even wanted him to be extradited. We will see what happens.

[NinaBrooke]

and i was right about Banon and her more than fishy character:

Today in austrian newspaper "der standard" was announced that Banon thought of pressing charges NOW (2011) for what happened back in 2002 but now does not do so anymore. Her comment " I don`t want to be instrumentalized by the american justice system". So , again, she is not reliable. Not a trustworthy person , considering she STABS the BACK of a fellow victim.

I see that as a major affront against the new victim. And i wonder how many else there are who don`t say a word. This is a scandal.

"Französin verzichtet auf Klage

"Wie am Freitagabend bekannt wurde, dürfte Strauss-Kahn zumindest diese Klage aber nun erspart bleiben. Laut ihrem Anwalt David Koubb änderte sie ihre Meinung, sie wolle auf keinen Fall von der amerikanischen Justiz instrumentalisiert werden, sagte der Anwalt am Freitag dem Sender BFM TV."

My translation:

"French woman does not press charges"

Friday evening it was known that Strauss-Kahn will be spared of at least this one charge (the case of the french journalist)
According to her attorney David Koubb she changed her opinion, because she does not want to be instrumentalized by the american justice system, this is what the attorney told the Television Station BFM TV"


SO my question again: who paid her to shut it in the first place, who suggested even more benefit when opening mouth and who suggested even more and more benefit for shutting it again AND spitting on american justice system in the same sentence.

So - what`s next with that one? Maybe someone steps up and offers more for talking again? Who knows? Some people clearly seem to have a price tag when it comes to ethical values.

[NinaBrooke]

That was why i was thinking of conspiracy first. He was an incredible good politician and a great head of IMF making inconvenient decisions:

"Strauss-Kahn was the first IMF director who disavowed the traditional IMF policy of imposing on the poor and ordinary people the cost of bailing out Wall Street and the Western banks. Strauss-Kahn said that regulation had to be reimposed on the greed-driven, fraud-prone financial sector, which, unregulated, destroyed the lives of ordinary people. Strauss-Kahn listened to Nobel economist Joseph Stiglitz, one of a handful of economists who has a social conscience."

[Fast Gunn]

The new Time Magazine Edition this week sketched in all the background to this story from many sources now coming forth.

Seems this guy has been foisting himself on a long string of ladies who have been so intimidated of his power and of how the French tend to dismiss such lecherous behavior in powerful men that they decided not to press charges which only made him think he was invincible. He even removed the bra from the god daughter of a former wife who came to interview him, but she was persuaded not to press charges.

In a dramatic closing scene, he was about to get away with this crime once more and was in fact already seated in the first class seat on a plane bound to Paris and out of USA jurisdiction when the police caught up to him and whisked him off to jail. It is doubtful that if this had happened in Paris that charges would have been brought against him.

Sometimes these arrogant men think that their power bestows special privileges and that they can do whatever they want to and know the women are usually weak and too afraid to complain because of the media circus and possible retribution.

These powerful people committing these crimes are living in denial and it finally takes a draconian prison sentence to finally make them understand that they have been living life all wrong all these years.

Despite all their brilliance, they never developed any decency.

. . . But now Judgment Day has come!

[pjorourke]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

a great head of IMF

oxymoron

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Fast Gunn

The new Time Magazine Edition this week sketched in all the background to this story from many sources now coming forth.

Seems this guy has been foisting himself on a long string of ladies who have been so intimidated of his power and of how the French tend to dismiss such lecherous behavior in powerful men that they decided not to press charges which only made him think he was invincible. He even removed the bra from the god daughter of a former wife who came to interview him, but she was persuaded not to press charges.

In a dramatic closing scene, he was about to get away with this crime once more and was in fact already seated in the first class seat on a plane bound to Paris and out of USA jurisdiction when the police caught up to him and whisked him off to jail. It is doubtful that if this had happened in Paris that charges would have been brought against him.

Sometimes these arrogant men think that their power bestows special privileges and that they can do whatever they want to and know the women are usually weak and too afraid to complain because of the media circus and possible retribution.

These powerful people committing these crimes are living in denial and it finally takes a draconian prison sentence to finally make them understand that they have been living life all wrong all these years.

Despite all their brilliance, they never developed any decency.

. . . But now Judgment Day has come!

I agree, i have to admit when i first thought of the conspiracy theories, i was not aware of the history of sexual abuse he already has . It just did not cross my mind that someone like him with his background would have made such a stupid and blunt "stunt" so to speak. But i smartened up, it seems to me now that France has covered up his previous attacks and BCD he was well known as someone that did these things (attacking women sexually)

OTOH, i don`t think only rich people live wrong and only powerful people rape and /or abuse women, i think its a matter of getting caught and/or getting away with it. When you tend to get away with things you do them over and over again until someone is strong enough to put a hold on these things. Unfortunately people are predictable and convenient. And as long as they don`t feel the harm they do to others they don`t stop doing what they do.

Interesting the french elites public reaction. Did you guys read about that too?
I strongly assume had this happened in france the police would not have even pressed charges. That is just a wild guess on my side.
What is interesting is that - as thig guy must have been in NYC longer and more often - if these things happen more often than this once.

Besides,
some people ( in france concerning that case) seem to confuse sexual attractivity with the violence aspect of coercing people into sex. The french elite seem to think of this a s ahoney trap because " a guy like him could have sex with anyone he pleases why would he need to force someone".
That is the usual stereotypical confusion that sexual violence has to do with sex in the first place. It is Violence and sex is an aspect of violence. Rape or sexual assault is about power and violence and NOT about sex. its a sexualized form of violence.

I have to admit in Europe the laws concerning assault (not rape!!! ) are different than in the USA where they are much much stricter. In good old europe its still condoned if you make sexualized comments on a work place (which this guy seemed to have done also) while in the USA - i assume (so i`ve heard) this is a criminal act. even touching someone at the shoulder can be filed as harrassment. I think in that sense the USA is more "emancipated" and this is one of the reasons i like that country.

[NinaBrooke]

The French Elites' Reaction To The Dominique Strauss-Kahn Affair Is A National Embarrassment

http://www.businessinsider.com/dsk-french-elites-2011-5

When the news of IMF chief Dominique Strauss-Kahn ("DSK")'s arrest for attempted rape came out, many of the noises coming out of France was that it was a national embarrassment.
And of course it is. Tabloids are making great headlines out of DSK's Frenchness and taste for women.

But the real national embarrassment for France is the response of its elites.
First came the two-faced appeals to the sacred "presumption of innocence" by French politicians on both sides of the aisle. DSK rival and self-proclaimed women's advocate Ségolène Royal extended her thoughts to DSK and his family for going through a very hard time, but did not have a word for the maid, for whom one suspects the past few days haven't been all roses.
The "presumption of innocence" was turned into a presumption of culpability of the accuser. Much ink was poured over how awful it is for DSK. And since DSK must be presumed innocent, not a word was spared to worry about the maid and her family, who are going through a hard time.

To the rescue came repeated fraudster and Roman Polanski defender Bernard-Henri Lévy (with friends like these, who needs enemies, Dominique?) who was shocked, shocked that in America "anyone can come along and accuse another fellow of any crime" (mon Dieu!), and suggests that DSK shouldn't be treated that way because, well, he's a very important man.

And then came the outrage over the perp walk. Pictures of people in handcuffs who haven't been convicted of a crime are illegal in France. "France Furious About Dominique Strauss-Kahn Perp Walk," we headlined. In reality, "France" was glued to their TV sets and to Twitter. It was a small French elite that was mortified.

Former justice minister Elisabeth Guigou said that the images showed "a brutality, a violence, of an incredible cruelty, and I’m happy that we don’t have the same judiciary system."
And yes, unlike getting sexually assaulted in a locked hotel room an internationally televised perp walk is brutal and humiliating.

But there is something even more "brutal" and "incredib[ly] cruel", and that's the law of silence that surrounds the affairs of important people in France.
When DSK allegedly tried to rape journalist Tristane Banon in 2002, she did not dare go public. And when she did, in 2007 on TV, she was bleeped out and uninvited from talk shows. The New Yorker's Adam Gopnik explains well (albeit with a handful of innacuracies) how France's privacy and libel laws protect the private lives of the powerful.

The Times has a long exposé of the decades-long "code of silence" by which the media protects the powerful.
Let's assume for a second that Banon and the hotel maid are correct. Who knows how many more sexual assaults like this occured, or might have occured? Who knows how many might have been prevented if the French media had done its job? The brutality, violence and incredible cruelty on display here are against the women and the little people who are told that they're alone, that they must shut up and move on. They are the brutality, violence and incredible cruelty of an elite that responds to democratic accountability as to a loud fart in a cocktail party.

And even if the accusations are false, there is simply no good case in a democracy that they shouldn't have been publicized.
So yes. The US media coverage of DSK's case can be lurid and nasty. But now the moral bankruptcy of the alternative is laid bare.
Transparency can be painful. It can be shocking. It's also very, very good.

Note: The author of this article is a French citizen and lives in Paris.


Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/dsk-f...#ixzz1N7C7IJzH

[WTF]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

Remember the woman in Lybia who got raped and went into a hotel room completely damaged and was "put away". No one has heard of her ever since.
.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...y-officer.html