So You Want to "Arm" Teachers?

[papadee]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

https://www.tcole.texas.gov/content/school-marshals



I recommend that you insist the school district BUY you on their dime a liability insurance policy that covers gross negligence if you can cant get one (probably won't get one for "intentional" acts) and I would suggest a minimum of $5 million per incident with provisions in there for hiring an attorney to defend (separate from the school district's attorney or regular lawyers for the school district). BTW: You don't want a "rider" on the district's general liability policy, you want a separate policy even with a separate insurer ... so they don't throw you under the buss for the district. See Florida's Sheriff!

Another recommendation is to have ALL COMMUNICATIONS with you in some recorded/written format that can be archived for at least four years and you have access to retain a copy for your records. Also make sure the district has a clear and unequivocal policies and procedures for your duties and jurisdiction (which will have to also meet the Texas Education Code policies with respect to "school police" and "campus cops"!

There's more ... but no charge for the above suggestions.

Glad you pointed this out. The whole"it won't cost much" angle ignored the cost of liability insurance. I wonder what the cost would be for arming 10%-20% of teachers.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by papadee

Glad you pointed this out. The whole"it won't cost much" angle ignored the cost of liability insurance. I wonder what the cost would be for arming 10%-20% of teachers.

Anyone who has been a teacher for any period of time KNOWS that if they get into a skirmish with a student the school district is going to throw the teacher's ass under the bus in a New York second to avoid the district getting sued. The teacher is "on his or her OWN!" The school districts who have PD's don't like them hanging around all "suited out" and the local PD's don't like the school cops either, because they consider them "security guards"!

Campus cops are delegated to directing traffic when school starts and lets out and making sure the buses get in and out of the parking lot and don't run over the kids. They are not taken seriously, on or off campuses. And it will an absolute shock of the district pay for equipment and training for an active shooting situation involving anything more than a cap gun. It's tough enough to get regular PDs and SOs to provide that level of training, which is expensive not only in training expenses, but overtime pay and substitutes for training while the officer is off playing shootem up!

[Yssup Rider]

Please. Let’s not get carried away. Gun toting teachers are key to a safe and healthy learning environment.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by garhkal

Exactly. Its like a story i saw elsewhere yesterday, where someone had a link to a school resource officer, who cause he didn't pay attention to his surroundings, had a filching 4 yr old put her finger IN THE HOLSTER and pulled the trigger on his gun..
AND WAS trying to use THAT as justification for taking ALL guns from resource officers/cops in schools away.?!

Any guns carried by teachers should have biometric safety devices incorporated.

[garhkal]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Anyone who has been a teacher for any period of time KNOWS that if they get into a skirmish with a student the school district is going to throw the teacher's ass under the bus in a New York second to avoid the district getting sued. The teacher is "on his or her OWN!" The school districts who have PD's don't like them hanging around all "suited out" and the local PD's don't like the school cops either, because they consider them "security guards"!

True dat. I've known one teacher who got fired the DAY SHE got sent to hospital, after 3 school thugs beat HER UP in the parkinglot. BUT cause she got video'ed HITTING ONE BACK, she was let go immediately..
NOT ONE OF THOSE 3 thugs got expelled, 2 got a month suspension, the other 3 months..

NOW THAT's fucked up.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Any guns carried by teachers should have biometric safety devices incorporated.

What?

You are kidding me aren't you?

Just put the "guns" in a lock box in a locked drawer in the teachers' desks ... and give the principal the combination for the lock box so he can announce it over the PA system!

You want to allow a teacher to wear a firearm that the teacher can't protect?

That's only one issue with arming Teachers. I've totaled up the blocks of instruction in the Texas basic peach officer academy curriculum mandated as a minimum bye the licensing authority and the MINIMUM hours related to carrying a weapon and using the weapon is approximately 120 hours ... BASIC COURSE ... The Department of Public Safety (who is supposed to overseeing CHL and now "School Marshal" training requirements has in its basic academy about 300 hours (even for officers who have worked for another department and are hired by the DPS). Those are BASIC BEGINNER levels of training. CHL is about 10 hours and about 1/2 of that is classroom instruction .. unless the instructor fudges to get to the "good part" ... shooting at paper ... sooner to build business.

The FBI training at Quantico for special response teams involving entries to active shooter or other armed conditions was about six weeks long.

Just after Columbine the FBI response teams revised a shorter curriculum for "first responders" that was about 32-40 hours with "paint" rounds for training with "bad guys" inside for the entry teams to find and neutralize. It was minimal training with the understanding that tactical practice would continue.

What school district is going to put teachers through an appropriate level of training to actually prepare them for "instinctive tactical" confrontations inside with hundreds of students around running, screaming, and behaving in an hysterical manner (not to mention staff and other teachers) while one or more shooters are firing all 50 to 100 rounds in a handful of minutes? Will the district issue adult diapers for them?

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by garhkal

Exactly. Its like a story i saw elsewhere yesterday, where someone had a link to a school resource officer, who cause he didn't pay attention to his surroundings, had a filching 4 yr old put her finger IN THE HOLSTER and pulled the trigger on his gun..
AND WAS trying to use THAT as justification for taking ALL guns from resource officers/cops in schools away.?!

That's the "school resource officer's" story ....

.. and he's sticking to it!

He should be fired for being a bad liar!

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

What?

You are kidding me aren't you?

Just put the "guns" in a lock box in a locked drawer in the teachers' desks ... and give the principal the combination for the lock box so he can announce it over the PA system!

You want to allow a teacher to wear a firearm that the teacher can't protect?

That's only one issue with arming Teachers. I've totaled up the blocks of instruction in the Texas basic peach officer academy curriculum mandated as a minimum bye the licensing authority and the MINIMUM hours related to carrying a weapon and using the weapon is approximately 120 hours ... BASIC COURSE ... The Department of Public Safety (who is supposed to overseeing CHL and now "School Marshal" training requirements has in its basic academy about 300 hours (even for officers who have worked for another department and are hired by the DPS). Those are BASIC BEGINNER levels of training. CHL is about 10 hours and about 1/2 of that is classroom instruction .. unless the instructor fudges to get to the "good part" ... shooting at paper ... sooner to build business.

The FBI training at Quantico for special response teams involving entries to active shooter or other armed conditions was about six weeks long.

Just after Columbine the FBI response teams revised a shorter curriculum for "first responders" that was about 32-40 hours with "paint" rounds for training with "bad guys" inside for the entry teams to find and neutralize. It was minimal training with the understanding that tactical practice would continue.

What school district is going to put teachers through an appropriate level of training to actually prepare them for "instinctive tactical" confrontations inside with hundreds of students around running, screaming, and behaving in an hysterical manner (not to mention staff and other teachers) while one or more shooters are firing all 50 to 100 rounds in a handful of minutes? Will the district issue adult diapers for them?

Biometric trigger locks. Modern U.S. prisons don't allow guards armed with guns to mingle with the inmates inside the wire. The mentality of some of those students is exactly the same as some of those inmates. Cruz was a student before he was a shooter. If a kid decides to become a shooter, at least insure he doesn't get his weapon from a teacher.

[Rey Lengua]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

What?

You are kidding me aren't you?

Just put the "guns" in a lock box in a locked drawer in the teachers' desks ... and give the principal the combination for the lock box so he can announce it over the PA system!

You want to allow a teacher to wear a firearm that the teacher can't protect?

That's only one issue with arming Teachers. I've totaled up the blocks of instruction in the Texas basic peach officer academy curriculum mandated as a minimum bye the licensing authority and the MINIMUM hours related to carrying a weapon and using the weapon is approximately 120 hours ... BASIC COURSE ... The Department of Public Safety (who is supposed to overseeing CHL and now "School Marshal" training requirements has in its basic academy about 300 hours (even for officers who have worked for another department and are hired by the DPS). Those are BASIC BEGINNER levels of training. CHL is about 10 hours and about 1/2 of that is classroom instruction .. unless the instructor fudges to get to the "good part" ... shooting at paper ... sooner to build business.

The FBI training at Quantico for special response teams involving entries to active shooter or other armed conditions was about six weeks long.

Just after Columbine the FBI response teams revised a shorter curriculum for "first responders" that was about 32-40 hours with "paint" rounds for training with "bad guys" inside for the entry teams to find and neutralize. It was minimal training with the understanding that tactical practice would continue.

What school district is going to put teachers through an appropriate level of training to actually prepare them for "instinctive tactical" confrontations inside with hundreds of students around running, screaming, and behaving in an hysterical manner (not to mention staff and other teachers) while one or more shooters are firing all 50 to 100 rounds in a handful of minutes? Will the district issue adult diapers for them?

The District may not be able to find adult diapers after the way that the LYING LIBERALS and their propagandists in the media have hoarded those products since the election !

[Budman]

I carry a semi auto daily but never have a round in the chamber. I'm not going to be in a quick draw situation so the addition second or two to chamber a round if necessary is insignificant. Using common sense around firearms is critical. I've never understood how someone can shoot themselves when cleaning a weapon other than they are stupid.

[grean]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Biometric trigger locks. Modern U.S. prisons don't allow guards armed with guns to mingle with the inmates inside the wire. The mentality of some of those students is exactly the same as some of those inmates. Cruz was a student before he was a shooter. If a kid decides to become a shooter, at least insure he doesn't get his weapon from a teacher.

I think retention level 2 or better ,holsters will suffice.

[grean]

Originally Posted by grean

I think retention level 2 or better ,holsters will suffice.

Again not LTC holders. These people would go through a fair amount of training.

Would it be possible to get a gun from the Marshal, maybe. It's likelyhood is unlikely.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by grean

I think retention level 2 or better ,holsters will suffice.

Then why don't U.S. prisons let their guards go inside the wire with guns if holsters will suffice? Especially, since it's the guards' sole responsibility to secure the prisoners, not educate them and be AV specialists, janitors, mentors and nannies when the occasion requires it?

[grean]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Then why don't U.S. prisons let their guards go inside the wire with guns if holsters will suffice? Especially, since it's the guards' sole responsibility to secure the prisoners, not educate them and be AV specialists, janitors, mentors and nannies when the occasion requires it?

I don't think the risk is that high.The prison guards are surrounded by bad guys who potential want to take their weapons.

99.9999% of school kids do not have a prisoners mentality.

Police walk the street and the number of incidents of police being disarmed is relatively low.


If I'm wrong, and I might be, and the numbers do support extra measures like that, then so be it.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by grean

I don't think the risk is that high.The prison guards are surrounded by bad guys who potential want to take their weapons.

97% of school kids do not have a prisoners mentality.

Police walk the street and the number of incidents of police being disarmed is relatively low.


If I'm wrong, and I might be, and the numbers do support extra measures like that, then so be it.

FTFY. The fact that Broward County instituted a school-to-prison pipeline initiative and had a Promise Program is proof that that too many school kids have a criminal mentality; then there are those who are mentally disturbed. Cruz was student. Trayvon Martin, who was caught with women's jewelry and burglary tools before he was caught casing apartments, was a student. Cops may "walk the streets" but they do not "walk in confined hallways" on a daily basis with literally hundreds of people who can unexpectedly reach out and touch them at any point and at any time. Teachers moving among students is much more akin to prison guards moving among inmates than policemen walking on a public sidewalk, and prison guards are not allowed to carry fire arms behind the wire.