Pelvic exams done without consent

[ANONONE]

It would really hinge on this phrase: specific consent

I have had a number of health problems recently, so, sometimes out of boredom, I began to read the fine print on all that damn paperwork we sign-off on in a rush just to feel better. Remember during intake, you are under a bit of duress. I don't know about you, but when I am seriously ill I would sign off on dirt from a chicken coop being rubbed in my eyes if it gets me some relief.

Somewhere along the line, a doctor friend convinced me to always choose a teaching hospital over even a prestigious private one. The idea being they are more cutting edge. The downside of this is that you will also be a lab experiment at times. The thing is, you signed off on that during admission.

I can't help if the real complaint here is that it involved a pelvic exam (gents let's go with prostate for our perspective) and that when they found out they were more offended, because they didn't really think through the implications of what they gave the hospital permission to do.

Would this be an issue if they just examined the cuticle of your big toe while under?

[Rudyard K]

Originally Posted by Nicolette Bordeauxva

But, is there a victim if the victim is unaware they have been victimized?

Short answer?...Yes!!

A person whose money is stolen by another doesn't have to know it to be a victim.

IMHO, knowledge of the event only causes one to "feel" victimized...they are still a victim. Luckily for the victim though...it doesn't feel as bad.

[Guest053011]

Originally Posted by ANONONE

It would really hinge on this phrase: specific consent

Would this be an issue if they just examined the cuticle of your big toe while under?

No it wouldn't be an issue for me. A pelvic exam is. Even probing around my mouth is. Something about it instinctively feels highly intrusive. I don't know why, and I don't really feel the need to probe.

I have the right to be aware of anything being done to me, conscious or unconscious, when I put myself into the hands of professionals. There are plenty of countries that do not partake in this behavior ad are still able to find people wiling to submit to the gynecological exam.

Dignity and boundaries.

[ANONONE]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

No it wouldn't be an issue for me. A pelvic exam is. Even probing around my mouth is. Something about it instinctively feels highly intrusive. I don't know why, and I don't really feel the need to probe.

I have the right to be aware of anything being done to me, conscious or unconscious, when I put myself into the hands of professionals. There are plenty of countries that do not partake in this behavior ad are still able to find people wiling to submit to the gynecological exam.

Dignity and boundaries.

Very well stated, Lauren.

I remember once when getting intrusive surgery I was on a Dilaudid drip. The doctor came in with a bunch of students and did extend the courteous gesture of asking first, although I have little memory of what he asked permission for and what they did since I was comfortably numb. They were there for a pretty long time--it least in seemed long in my haze. I vaguely remember some poking and prodding and they all took turns doing vitals like blood pressure and O2 saturation measuring.

I do not recall any of the female students remarking that I had an abnormally large penis, so I must have been lucid. Days later I did not have a third nipple or feel discomfort in any of my body cavities, so they must have been safe and gentle.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/...rticle1447337/
The most intriguing part of the survey, though, is that it showed that women are quite willing to undergo these gynecological exams – if they're asked.

Sixty-two per cent of respondents said they would consent to medical students doing pelvic exams, and an additional 5 per cent said “yes” but only if a female student was doing the exam.

.

Jesus...rape, sexual assualt. Nowhere in the article did anything imply that it was raised to that level. No God Damn wonder our health care cost are so high here in the states.

It was/is really stupid for them not to get consent. It appears most Canadians are level headed and would agree to helping med students in training for that field by consenting to the very thing that most are objecting to.


I see nothing wrong with it if they had just asked. If I were in charge of the Canadian health care system and some lady objected to her free care because we may use her body for training in a professional way.....She may just have to start paying for her free care.

as a side note...If you are for warrantless wiretaps you should be for these sneak and peek procedures. Sorry cheap shot at my conservative friends on the board.

[Rudyard K]

Originally Posted by WTF

If you are for warrantless wiretaps you should be for these sneak and peek procedures. Sorry cheap shot at my conservative friends on the board.

Makes about as much sense as...If you are for free health care you should be for these sneak and peek procedures. Oh, wait a minute?...I think you did just say that.

Sorry, cheap shot at my "liberal-nut-job" friends on the board.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

Makes about as much sense as...If you are for free health care you should be for these sneak and peek procedures. Oh, wait a minute?...I think you did just say that.

No I said that if you were for free health care then you should surely give your consent to these procedures, if not I just may charge you more for your surgey. There is an ever so slight difference!

I do not believe that they should do it without your consent. I also believe that people that enjoy and promote this so called free health care should be willing to give something back to keep costs down. I was merely pointing that fact out to certain posters.

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

Sorry, cheap shot at my "liberal-nut-job" friends on the board.

LOL

conservative friends vs. liberal-nut-job??????????????? Come on RK I didn't say my ''conservative 'Nazi' friends''! Though I do see how that is implicit in these days and times!

[sofiaofhouston]

Let's turn the tables......What if you gent's were given an extensive anal, rectal exam. many people poking around your anus and your rectum inserting instruments?.....OR what if you were violated by a male nurse while under?

[Happy Diver]

Originally Posted by Nicolette Bordeauxva

The rapist is a criminal and his actions are immoral, true. But, is there a victim if the victim is unaware they have been victimized?

Yes, if a person is knocked unconscious they are still a victim. If an Alzheimer's patient is raped, she/he is still a victim. Human dignity has value.

[guest051510-1]

I was think more on the line of: telling a lie to a fish. But, actually in my situation, I don't feel like a victim, but then again, I don't know if I was victimized. Either way, in my case, ignorance is bliss and I have used the same doctor many times since.

eta: Now, if I was victimized and discover that later, i.e. they find it on video tape, at THAT point I would feel like a victim. But, up until that point of finding out, I'm fine.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by sofiaofhouston

Let's turn the tables......What if you gent's were given an extensive anal, rectal exam. many people poking around your anus and your rectum inserting instruments?.....OR what if you were violated by a male nurse while under?

That is not turning the tables....that is just stirring chit.












Seriously....under the same circumstances I would want them to inform me my a-hole was going to be used for a teaching moment. WTF....I am getting FREE healthcare, I should at least care enough to put ,my ass on the line!

Would I want some nurse in there giving me a hummer....I'd prefer she leave me a raincheck.

No where in the article did I see where it was not done in a controlled environment so ur example of some male nurse porking me is much ado about nutn.

[OneHotMale]

Originally Posted by WTF

That is not turning the tables....that is just stirring chit.












Seriously....under the same circumstances I would want them to inform me my a-hole was going to be used for a teaching moment. WTF....I am getting FREE healthcare, I should at least care enough to put ,my ass on the line!

Would I want some nurse in there giving me a hummer....I'd prefer she leave me a raincheck.

No where in the article did I see where it was not done in a controlled environment some ur example of some male nurse porking me is much ado about nutn.

Damn and all this time I was under the impression that you used an Aggie Vet. for your free healthcare WTF.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by OneHotMale

Damn and all this time I was under the impression that you used an Aggie Vet. for your free healthcare WTF.

LMAO....Funny thing is that be more than a little true!

[OneHotMale]

Originally Posted by WTF

LMAO....Funny thing is that be more than a little true!

LMAO!!!!! Just give him enough time and when he gets enough of that kool aid in you then he will probably start advertising as a proctologist also.

[Guest083011]

Originally Posted by Nicolette Bordeauxva

I was think more on the line of: telling a lie to a fish. But, actually in my situation, I don't feel like a victim, but then again, I don't know if I was victimized. Either way, in my case, ignorance is bliss and I have used the same doctor many times since.

eta: Now, if I was victimized and discover that later, i.e. they find it on video tape, at THAT point I would feel like a victim. But, up until that point of finding out, I'm fine.

Colette, whether it "made it to tape" is not relavant. The question is if hospital staff went below your belt for reasons not related to your breast surgery. paper undies are probably not very strong so they would tear easy. If you had a long surgery (unusual for reduction or augmentation, but if it was reconstructive, it might take a long time or a plain old slow doctor), they might have catherized you and it would be bye bye undies. As a side note I hope that surgery was not for anything serious and hopefully elective.