LIBERALS LOVE POLITIFACT............HAHAHAHA HAHA !!!!!!

[JD Barleycorn]

Sins it seems pretty obvioius, if any Jeeps are made in China then they weren't made here at home. If they were not made here at home then some American did not get a job making them. The job that was created was Chinese. So Americans then come up short on jobs.

Novacaine you seem to okay with the job losses as long as Obama can say that others did it too. Kind of like the Obama phone. Under Bush, who originated the plan, about 150,000 phones were given out. Under Obama it is over 4 millioni. There are always business people looking to find cheaper labor and new markets but GM was not in bed with Bush and the CEO of GM was not in the position of advising the White House and you didn't have the White House lying about job creation. The excuse that others did it some so my guy can do it alot doesn't work.

[novacain]

JD, those jobs were never here to be lost, they have been Chinese jobs from 1985 until 2009, what part of that did you miss, or did you not bother to read the article. Obama never said it was ok for him to do it cause all of those presidents did, you are trying saying he said that.
The point I was making was that it wasn't an issue for all those years but now suddenly it's a huge issue, tell me what has changed to make it an issue now? From 1985 to 2009 those jobs were never here and never going to be here. What Fiat is doing with possibly opening a plant in China is just good business............. maybe that is lost on you.

If you build it here for $100 and then pay $100 to ship it there were you can only sell it for $150, you lose $50 on every unit.......... it's smarter to build it there for $100 and sell it there for $150 and make $50 on every unit. Losing money on each unit and other bad business moves are why the auto industry needed to the bail out that cost the tax payers! Would you as a tax payer like to bail them out again by forcing them to lose money by doing it here?

[i'va biggen]

JD is a teacher ,but not in economics.

[JD Barleycorn]

I never said that Obama excused himself. I said that his supporters (and you) excused him because it was done earlier. If you had a prior boyfriend who took a swing at you when he was under stress would that excuse your current boyfriend who wants to beat the living shit out of your for no apparent reason. It doesn't make what the first did right but does that excuse the current one?

Always remember, under Bush, Clinton, and Bush GM was an independent business with no ties to the White House or government. That all changed after they took the money from Obama and he gave much of the company to the unions.

[novacain]

He also doesn't teach basic common sense, basic business or basic reading comprehension.

Where did I excuse him.......... all I did was point out a fact, sorry you don't like the fact but it is still a FACT. We're discussing Jeep, not GM please try to keep up with the grown up conversation or don't participate

And please JD, just because you lead an alternative life style, don't assume I do also................ you know you should get out of that relationship if your boyfriend hits you............. unless of course you like it rough............. if that's the case you might wanna tell your tale in the another realm forum.

[Munchmasterman]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

POLITIFACT, the liberal "fact check" site run by the awful St. Petersburg Times, awarded Romney with "Lie of the Year".........................

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

Lie of the Year: the Romney campaign's ad on Jeeps made in China
It turns out Romney was right.
In your world, if I said "Romney is dead" it wouldn't be a lie. Because someday he would be dead and you would make my statement retro-actively true.
No, he lied when he said this;
"I saw a story today, that one of the great manufacturers in this state, Jeep, now owned by the Italians, is thinking of moving all production to China," he said, to boos from the audience. "I will fight for every good job in America. I’m going to fight to make sure trade is fair, and if it’s fair, America will win."
Reuters News: Fiat sees at least 100,000 Jeeps made in China in 2014
The libtards can never get their facts straight; just ask CJ.
I always knew you were a libertard.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/01/17/uk-fiat-marchionne-china-idUKBRE90G0O620130117
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2013/01/17/uk-fiat-marchionne-china-idUKBRE90G0O620130117
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2012/dec/12/lie-year-2012-Romney-Jeeps-China/

Chrysler issued this statement.
"Romney’s words drew an immediate and firm denial from Chrysler headquarters. "Jeep has no intention of shifting production of its Jeep models out of North America to China," the statement said. "A careful and unbiased reading of the Bloomberg take would have saved unnecessary fantasies and extravagant comments."

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

You are doing what liberals do; lie about what Romney said.

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

Romney said (watch for yourself):
No one cares what he did or didn't say in this one video. The quotes atributed to him were said by him.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQ8P04q6jqE&feature=yo utu.be
And the Reuter's story is correct, proving Romney was telling the truth when he said...
"President Obama took Chrysler and GM into bankruptcy and even sold Chrysler to the Italians, who are going to build jeeps in China."
Obama, PolitiFact and liberals lied. Romney told the truth.

"But later that night at a campaign stop in Defiance, Ohio, Romney added a new line to his stump speech:"

"I saw a story today, that one of the great manufacturers in this state, Jeep, now owned by the Italians, is thinking of moving all production to China," he said, to boos from the audience. "I will fight for every good job in America. I’m going to fight to make sure trade is fair, and if it’s fair, America will win."

Chrysler was moving no production out of the US to China. Chrysler has idle plants in China. Production would be done there for Chinese models.

How Fiat got Chrysler

By early 2008, it was clear that GM and Chrysler were teetering. Both firms had huge debts and high costs. The recession had slowed car sales to a trickle. Chrysler’s owner, Cerberus Capital Management, was hunting for a buyer and had been talking to Italian carmaker Fiat. In late 2008, President George W. Bush approved billion dollar loans to the companies to keep them afloat.

On Jan. 20, 2009, the day Obama took the oath of office, Fiat announced it was interested in buying Chrysler. Obama created an auto task force and in March, the task force told Chrysler to cut a deal with Fiat or be cut off from further government loans. In early April, Chrysler filed for bankruptcy and at the same time, announced an alliance with Fiat.

By the end of April, the terms of the deal were complete and by June, it was finalized. Cerberus Capital had lost its stake, and Fiat held 20 percent of the new Chrysler and had full operational control.

Steve Rattner, chair of the president’s auto task force, said Fiat was essential to Chrysler’s survival.

"If we had been unable to strike this arrangement with Fiat, I believe that we would have allowed Chrysler to liquidate. So it was a great outcome for all concerned," Rattner said.

Aaron Bragman, a senior analyst with IHS Automotive, a financial research group, said the government couldn’t sell Chrysler because it never owned it. In fact, the auto industry and Chrysler were in such bad shape, this wasn’t a sale at all in the conventional sense.

"Fiat paid nothing for Chrysler," Bragman said, but "they poured MASSIVE resources into the company, such as design help, executive staff and personnel, joint development, engine technology, all sorts of non-cash things that helped Chrysler recover considerably."

Chrysler is now profitable. Laid-off union workers have been rehired, and the company is adding new personnel.

Fiat, Jeeps, and China

When Fiat got Chrysler, it got Jeep. Right before the ad came out, Romney told a crowd in Defiance, Ohio, that plans were afoot to shift the Jeep jobs in Ohio to China.

"I saw a story today that one of the great manufacturers in this state Jeep — now owned by the Italians — is thinking of moving all production to China," Romney said.

Romney had been working off an article from Bloomberg News about Fiat’s discussions to start making Jeeps again in China. The old Chrysler had assembly plants in China, but they had been idle since 2009.

Romney’s words drew an immediate and firm denial from Chrysler headquarters. "Jeep has no intention of shifting production of its Jeep models out of North America to China," the statement said. "A careful and unbiased reading of the Bloomberg take would have saved unnecessary fantasies and extravagant comments."

Bragman, the auto analyst, said Romney’s notion that expansion in China comes at a cost to American workers runs counter to the facts. Chrysler’s Toledo plant is running at full capacity, and its Detroit plant is at three shifts. Chrysler is building cars in the United States for sale here.
The production of cars in China is a sign of Chrysler's growing strength in overseas markets. It would like to build Jeeps in China to sell in China. It is not outsourcing American auto jobs.

"I'm astonished that more people aren't thrilled by the fact that an American company on the brink of literal oblivion has come back strong enough to now once again be making and selling its products in the hottest auto market in the world," Bragman said. "It is a phenomenal success story, quite frankly, and one that has sadly been bizarrely twisted out of shape for political expediency."

Our ruling

The Romney campaign ad says Obama "sold Chrysler to Italians who are going to build Jeeps in China" at the cost of American jobs. The ad leaves the clear impression that Jeeps built in China come at the expense of American workers.

The ad miscasts the government’s role in Fiat’s acquisition of Chrysler, and it misrepresents the outcome. Chrysler’s owners had been trying to sell to Italy-based Fiat before Obama took office. The ad ignores the return of American jobs to Chrysler Jeep plants in the United States, and it presents the manufacture of Jeeps in China as a threat, rather than an opportunity to sell cars made in China to Chinese consumers. It strings together facts in a way that presents an wholly inaccurate picture.

We rate the statement Pants on Fire!

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

SoF; you cannot be a conservative ????????????

Like you are a conservative. You embarrass them and they would have you purged, right along with the birthers.
To sum things up.
Romney's lie beats out yours only because he is a player on the national stage.
You could have been a contender.

[Munchmasterman]

[QUOTE=JD Barleycorn;1052235047]I never said that Obama excused himself. I said that his supporters (and you) excused him because it was done earlier. If you had a prior boyfriend who took a swing at you when he was under stress would that excuse your current boyfriend who wants to beat the living shit out of your for no apparent reason. It doesn't make what the first did right but does that excuse the current one?

Always remember, under Bush, Clinton, and Bush GM was an independent business with no ties to the White House or government.(and had steadily been losing money. Now they are profitable) That all changed after they took the money from Obama and he gave much of the company to the unions. (The union made large concessions. I'm calling you a cowardly liar. Prove Obama gave much of the company to the unions. Of course you are too without honor to retract your statement or prove it is true[/QUOTE]

It wouldn't be a jd post without an apples to peaches comparison (so jd, when did you stop beating your wife?), half of a fact, and a lie.

[Whirlaway]

Classic lefty deflection;

The PolitiFact "Lie of the Year" award was to a Romney ad which NEVER mentioned "all production"................... .

The Romney ad was factually correct and PolitiFact was wrong !

FACT JACK !

[thisguy23]

The lie of the year is that your health Ins is going to get cheaper. I dont need to look any facts up, all I have to do is look at my bill. 28% increase last year.

Noboma doesn't care about guns, jobs, health ins, or any of that. All he cares about is getting the 47% changed to 55%, when that happens he will have achieved his total transformation of the USA..

[i'va biggen]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

Classic lefty deflection;

The PolitiFact "Lie of the Year" award was to a Romney ad which NEVER mentioned "all production"................... .

The Romney ad was factually correct and PolitiFact was wrong !

FACT JACK !

fucking right wingers will defend anything.

[SinsOfTheFlesh]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

SoF; you cannot be a conservative ????????????

I think I am the better judge of my political orientation Whirly.

Yes, Politifact pretends to be a fact check site with the same level of credibility that factcheck.org possesses.

However, there is no getting around the fact that the Romney ad was engineered to give the viewer the impression that Fiat would begin production of Jeeps in China, at the expense of American jobs. They didn't HAVE to say it in so many words. The entire point of the ad was to leave the viewer with the impression that Obama set a chain of events in motion that cost American job, while Romney is going to "fight for every American job". If the viewer is not convinced that American jobs are about to be lost to China, then the entire ad becomes meaningless.

The problem though is that this simply is not the case, and Romney knew it. Fiat intended to begin production of Jeeps in China that were to be sold TO China. Much the same way that Toyota manufactures cars HERE, to be sold HERE. It is much cheaper to assemble a car in the country where it is to be sold rather than pay the cost of shipping and import duties. The article you linked spells this out very clearly. Like CJ, you posted what you did not read or understand.

This is the sort of political subterfuge that I find repugnant, and fully expect to come from Democrats. Politifact should have jumped up and down on Obama's ad claiming that Romney was responsible for a worker's wife dying of cancer after he lost his job when Bain Capitol took over. Now THAT was a blatant lie and beyond despicable. Yet, coming from Obama, it is hardly shocking. However I expected better from Romney. The difference between you and I is that I hold the leaders I respect to a higher standard, not a lower one. I don't let my political leanings get in the way of the facts. When someone is wrong, I say they are wrong regardless of whether they have an R or a D after their name.

[essence]

Originally Posted by SinsOfTheFlesh

I don't let my political leanings get in the way of the facts. When someone is wrong, I say they are wrong regardless of whether they have an R or a D after their name.

+1000

Rare here.

Even more rare is when somebody gets the facts wrong, and then admits it. No, we all have to pretend to be perfect on here. Fight to the death of both parties.

[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by novacain

JD, those jobs were never here to be lost, they have been Chinese jobs from 1985 until 2009, what part of that did you miss, or did you not bother to read the article. Obama never said it was ok for him to do it cause all of those presidents did, you are trying saying he said that.
The point I was making was that it wasn't an issue for all those years but now suddenly it's a huge issue, tell me what has changed to make it an issue now? From 1985 to 2009 those jobs were never here and never going to be here. What Fiat is doing with possibly opening a plant in China is just good business............. maybe that is lost on you.

If you build it here for $100 and then pay $100 to ship it there were you can only sell it for $150, you lose $50 on every unit.......... it's smarter to build it there for $100 and sell it there for $150 and make $50 on every unit. Losing money on each unit and other bad business moves are why the auto industry needed to the bail out that cost the tax payers! Would you as a tax payer like to bail them out again by forcing them to lose money by doing it here?

The UAW got a bailout, not the auto industry. Obama stole billions from private investors who held GM corporate bonds. They would have had first lien status in a bankruptcy that proceeded according to federal law; Obama took that away.

Obama did a "managed bankruptcy" that gave partial ownership to the UAW; a little like forcing a woman to marry the man who raped her. The UAW caused GM's bankruptcy in the first place by bargaining for absurdly generous benefits. GM is a zombie company; without tax payer money, it will collapse. Obama did not allow for aggressive renegotiations of UAW contracts that would have allowed GM to emerge from bankruptcy with the possibility of actually being a profitable company, not requiring billions from tax payers.

Forbes magazine says GM is headed for a second bankruptcy.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/louiswoo...kruptcy-again/

[Chica Chaser]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

Forbes magazine says GM is headed for a second bankruptcy.

We'll bail them out again, we got plenty of money. After all, GM is too big to fail.

[Yssup Rider]

Joe Bloe says the SKY IS FALLING EVERY FUCKING DAY!

FORBES didn't say this. One of their bloggers did in an op-ed column. This is the same guy who has publicly blasted electric cars and lied about it in his blog. http://www.plugincars.com/october-20...ne-108728.html

He also posts blogs on other sites as well.

FORBES SAID THIS? You're pathetic.

As much as you accuse others of stupidity you still haven't figured out how the media works, have you, BLOEHARD?