Bill Clinton is a total madman

[CuteOldGuy]

Somehow, I don't think that fighting against Hitler was the wrong thing. We should have listened to Patton when who wanted to join with Germans after the Nazis were defeated, to invade the Soviet Union. He was afraid that by not neutralizing the Soviets, we would eventually realize that we had, in fact, lost the war.

[I B Hankering]

And Hitler declared war on the U.S. on 11 December 1941 -- four days after Japan bombed Pearl Harbor -- making a U.S. declaration of war against Germany a moot point for FDR.

[theaustinescorts]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

The Nazi's were monsters. What are reading that says 95% of the German atrocities never happened? That's nuts. Let me guess, was it David Duke?

There isn't a single historian anywhere who still believes that gas chambers were used in the 22 concentration camps alleged at Nuremberg.

Every one of these camps was found through subsequent research to NOT have such facilities EXCEPT for the five camps in Poland, which were until 1989 under Soviet control and unavailable to any researcher.

Since 1989 examination of the Polish camps has revealed nothing that is consistent with there being gas chambers there either....nothing.

There were no gas chambers anywhere.

There is no evidence.

Even the Polish government removed the monument at Aushwitz stating that "5 million people were killed" there.

The monument has been removed.

If you want try reading the facts behind such figures as Ann Frank. She wasn't killed by anyone in any camp. She was sent from Aushwitz to another camp in Germany where she died of Typhus. Her father also contracted Typhus at Auschwitz and was sent to the hospital there for treatment, however he died despite the efforts of the hospital staff to keep him alive. There were hospitals in all the camps. There were also football fields, theaters, movies, and at Auschwitz even a swimming pool. The USC Shoah project funded by Stephen Speilberg has documented all these facts from survivor testimony. Very few survivors persist in claims of mass murder and other myths.

[CuteOldGuy]

Hey, AE. Do you have any links to cites which would support your statements? I'm finding hard to believe that fighting against the Nazis was a mistake. However, I agree with Patton that as long as we were over there, we might as well take down the Soviets. In his words, "We're going to fight them someday."

[theaustinescorts]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

And Hitler declared war on the U.S. on 11 December 1941 -- four days after Japan bombed Pearl Harbor -- making a U.S. declaration of war against Germany a moot point for FDR.

It's well understood that FDR was hoping for war with Germany and had undertaken many actions to bring it about. After Pearl Harbor FDR made sure that the campaign against Germany was the first priority rather than that against Japan. Hitler had no choice but to declare war under the circumstances facing the German navy in the atlantic given what the US was doing there.

[theaustinescorts]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Hey, AE. Do you have any links to cites which would support your statements? I'm finding hard to believe that fighting against the Nazis was a mistake. However, I agree with Patton that as long as we were over there, we might as well take down the Soviets. In his words, "We're going to fight them someday."

I'm not good at providing links because I don't read from the internet. I tend to read books.

Any history of the CIA will reveal that the US operated the "rat line" in which former Nazis escaped, and that the entire Nazi intl apperatus was revived and became the West German intelligence service.

You can go to Youtube and see many documentaries about the Nuremberg trials and the subsequent admissions that there were no gas chambers in any of the 22 camps except for those in Poland. All those documentaries show that the Polish government removed the "5 million deaths" monument from Auschwitz.

If you read any of Gore Vidal's essays about the war period he explains clearly what everyone knew but didn't want to admit.....that the US officer corps was pro-German and hated the communists. Patton was just the most vocal after the war. I mean for crying out loud it was the Soviets who attacked Finland and the Baltic states, as well as conquering more of Poland in 1939 than the Germans did! How could anyone reading the papers miss that.

There were reasons why such people as Charlse Lindberg, Joseph Kennedy, and countless others less known were pro-German. But once war came everyone had to tow the line or face the consequences. War is funny that way.

The biggest thing FDR did however was join with Stalin in 1942 and shock the world by declaring that the US would not negotiate any peace with Germany, and would fight until Germany was totally occupied, conquered, and it's government overthrown. Until this shocking announcement most Americans thought the war would bring about an armistice and peace agreement like all other wars.

The Germans had been making peace proposals to the British continuously since the beginning of war in 1939. The Nazis even sent Rudolf Hess to Britain in a parachut to try to make peace happen. He remained in jail with no one allowed to speak to him until he was killed fifty years later.

[gnadfly]

My understanding is that Xylene gas was cost prohibited and just not available. Shortly after the Nazis just ran a exhaust hose from a diesel truck engine to like a shipping container. Jump to the next paragraph if you are squeamish. The account I read on this was from the Jewish survivors whose job it was to pull out the bodies. The babies and small children were always on the bottom. Then the elderly, then the women and at the top where the men. It was simply a fight to get the last gulp of oxygen.

We were forced to sit thru Nazi atrocity films in Parochial school. That stays with you forever. Also, a guy I work with father is a Holocaust survivor and gives inspiring speeches throughout the area.

I don't think Bill Clinton is a total madman. He is a narcissist with many flaws. Hitler was a total madman. Check out Frankl's "Man's Search For Meaning."

[theaustinescorts]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

My understanding is that Xylene gas was cost prohibited and just not available. Shortly after the Nazis just ran a exhaust hose from a diesel truck engine to like a shipping container. Jump to the next paragraph if you are squeamish. The account I read on this was from the Jewish survivors whose job it was to pull out the bodies. The babies and small children were always on the bottom. Then the elderly, then the women and at the top where the men. It was simply a fight to get the last gulp of oxygen.

We were forced to sit thru Nazi atrocity films in Parochial school. That stays with you forever. Also, a guy I work with father is a Holocaust survivor and gives inspiring speeches throughout the area.

I don't think Bill Clinton is a total madman. He is a narcissist with many flaws. Hitler was a total madman. Check out Frankl's "Man's Search For Meaning."

There are a handful of "survivors" who make a nice living giving speeches about what they claim to have witnessed, and most of those people have been shown to have not really have been in the camps.

If you want to know the truth about what it was really like you can go to the thousands of oral histories at the USC Shoah project. These thousands of real survivors tell a very different story. Yes they were slaves used as labor, but there was no mass murder or genocide.

The million or so communists and Jews that were murdered in eastern Europe were killed by Nazis in cooperation with anti-communists in those areas. As the Nazis moved through the anti-communists would round up all the Jews in every village and town and take them to places to be murdered. The anti-communists had no weapons however so the Germans volunteered to do the shooting. These were true war crimes, and constitute the whole of the holocaust against the Jews, but it wasn't a program to exterminate all the Jews of Europe in death camps.

Zyclon-B was used in huge quantities in de-lousing chambers to kill pests which caused Typhus and other deseases in the camps, where living conditions were pretty aweful and epidemics killed many people. At the end of the war there was no food to feed the Army much less the camp inmates, and starvation occurred, making the desease situation much worse.

The so-called "Wonsee Conference Transcript" where Eichmann is said to have arrived at an agreement for the genocide has proven to be a hoax. It's from that transcript alone, along with some dubious films, that the story was spun about the carbon monoxide trucks, etc. These methods were in fact however tested in the T2 euthanasia program until the Catholic Church protested and it was curtailed.

The Germans were actually very meticulous about recording the numbers of people they murdered in the east. Whenever they murdered in such war crime situations they always left clear evidence behind. The true evidence clearly shows the Nazis murdered 1.5 million Jews.

[I B Hankering]

I've been studying the Holocaust on-and-off for about 50 years. The Holocaust happened. It is documented in film. It's documented in pictures. It is documented in journals, reports, autobiographies and diaries of men and women who survived and who liberated the camps. It is documented in the mass grave sites where the Nazis were unable to disinter and burn the bodies of their victims; wherein each body is a mute testimonial of Nazi atrocities. For example:


. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Pile of bodies in front of the Dachau crematorium, May 1945 .
. . . . . . . . . . . . . .Photo Credit: Donald E. Jackson, 40th Combat Engineer Regiment
On April 30, 1945, the day after the Dachau concentration camp was liberated, the 40th Combat Engineer Regiment, which was supporting the 45th Thunderbird Division, arrived to take over in the aftermath of the liberation. The soldier in the photo above is Eldon Patterson of E Company, 40th Combat Engineers. In the background is a pile of naked dead bodies, stacked up outside the crematorium. Behind the bodies is Baracke X, the crematorium building, with a wooden structure attached to the brick building. This structure, which has long since been removed, was mentioned in the Chavez Report, written by a US Army officer, after the liberation of Dachau. This report, which was subsequently entered into the Nuremberg International Military Tribunal as Documents 159L and 2430-PS.


http://www.scrapbookpages.com/dachauscrapbook/dachauliberation/aftermath.html

[theaustinescorts]

Acedemic historians have found that these forms of evidence just have not stood up.

The starving people in the camps were starving because there was no food. The thousands of camp survivors who have been interviewed on film say there was no genocide...only a handful make that claim. It's been admitted that the confessions presented at Nuremberg were made under torture. It's been admitted that the films of tattood skin lampshades and the "gas chamber" at Dachau were hoaxes by Army Intelligence. If you go to Dachau or Aushwitz today you will be told that what's shown as a "gas chamber" is "a representation of what such a chamber could have been like but this really isn't an actual chamber..."

It's actually known that over 1.5 million Jews were brutally slaughtered by the Germans in cooperation with anti-communist partisans in the east because all the communist partisans and NKVD personnel were all Jewish. The Germans kept detailed records of every single Jewish man, woman and child murdered in that way. They also kept records of everyone who died in the camps, and how they died.

It was a terrible and unforgiveable crime, but it was not a genocide.

And as bad as it was it was not as bad as what the Soviets did in each and every one of these countries.

That's why the CIA helped Nazi war criminals escape, and worked with them after the war to try to defeat Stalin.

In all these efforts the CIA did not succeed.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

Acedemic historians have found that these forms of evidence just have not stood up.

Ah, but it has.

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

It's actually known that over 1.5 million Jews were brutally slaughtered by the Germans . . . it was not a genocide.

That IS genocide, and the actual number is much higher.

[theaustinescorts]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Ah, but it has.

That IS genocide, and the actual number is much higher.

The claim of genocide is that 5 million Jews were rounded up from all over Europe and gased in death camps.

The testimony of 99% of survivors [of which there are hundreds of thousands] as well as physical examination of the facilities and records indicates it just didn't happen.

What did happen according to the documents and testimony is that US Army Intelligence fabricated a hoax at Nuremberg to deflect future criticism of the US and Britain for having killed hundreds of thousands of civilians in bombings of cities which had no military value.

The records show that 1.5 million Jews were murdered in the east by local groups in cooperation with the Germans, and untold hundreds of thousands died in labor camps from desease and starvation. These deaths included Gypies, communists, socialists, and anyone made a slave by the state.

It was horrible and monsterous, but not as monterous as the communists.

The communists were the greater evil.

[Guest032516]

AustinEscorts:

You are a seriously sick, twisted individual. Your posts in this thread are some of the most disturbing posts I have ever read.

There are plenty of books written by crackpot, racist, anti-Semites that vainly attempt to deny the Holocaust. Apparently, you have read all of them. But only them.

You throw out one unsupported allegation after another: "99% of all academics agree...", or "95% of concentration camp survivors admit that...", or "95% of the allegations at the Nuremberg trials..." and so on. Really? Where do you get that bullshit? From your racist, drunken relatives down in the trailer park?

Do you have ANY reference material that you can cite to us? You say you don't post links to your sources because you read books. OK, give us the names of the books. Or will you suddenly be unable to remember them?

And please don't cite any "books" from Lew Rockwell or Lyndon LaRouche or any other conspiracy nut. Those crackpots just make stuff up and sell it to gullible assholes like you.

And don't cite any "academics" at Bob Jones "University" or any other Bible-thumper "college". A diploma from one of those places is only useful as toilet paper.

No serious academic at any reputable university (like, say Harvard, Yale, any other Ivy, Stanford, MIT, Rice, Georgetown, UT, A&M, or a hundred others) thinks the Holocaust did not happen or that it has even been exaggerated.

Prior to WWII, Berlin alone had over 300,000 Jews living in it. After WWII, ALL of Germany had less than 25,000 Jews. Where did they all go?

And I doubt very much that "hundreds of thousands" of Jews survived the death camps. But really, even if that was true, what difference does it make if 200K survived, but 6 MILLION died? Do you think that means the death camps were some kind of Club Med?

I understand why some Germans might try to deny the Holocaust. It is just too much for them to bear to know that their nation, their people, their families could have done such a horrific thing.

But what is your excuse?

[theaustinescorts]

The fact that you stoop to insults shows that you have no evidence or knowledge on your side.

Here's some real evidence.

After Steven Speilberg produced the fictional "Shindler's List" he produced a non-fiction film, "The Last Days."

Unfortunately after the film's release it turned out that most of the "survivors" in the film were liars. They were a small number of such liars who have made handsome livings out of fabricating tails of mass murders in the camps, consistent with the hoaxes of the Nuremberg trials.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=80GgRWuXc08

After these "witnesses" were discredited Speilberg wanted to get to the truth of what really happend, so he endowed USC with millions of dollars to track down and record on film the testimony of as many living camp survivors as could be found.

This project, the "Shoah Project of USC" has provided for the first time an accurate account of what life was like in the camps, told by thousands of camp survivors instead of the handful of liars who are otherwise the only ones heard.

According to 99% of these survivors there was no mass killings. There were however hospitals, football leagues, theaters, and at Auschwitz even a swimming pool. All of this is totally consistent with what the International Red Cross found on their many visits to the camps.

BTW the IRC also cooperated with the CIA and the Vatican to help German "war criminals" escape from Europe.

Just because the public continues to believe these myths doesn't mean there's any evidence.

The public also believes that Stalin died from a stroke when he didn't [he was murdered in a coup on March 23, 1953]

The public also believes that Hitler died in a bunker and his body burned [Hitler and Martin Boorman escaped to Argentina and lived there for years with CIA assistance].

While Hitler and Boorman were safely in Argentina having children and eating bratwurst Hitler's chief intelligence officer, Reinhard Gehlen, was set up with his entire apperatus by the CIA as West Germany's new Intelligence Service. Gehlen and his group remained in control of all West German Intelligence until their respective retirements.

[i'va biggen]

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

The fact that you stoop to insults shows that you have no evidence or knowledge on your side.

Here's some real evidence.

After Steven Speilberg produced the fictional "Shindler's List" he produced a non-fiction film, "The Last Days."

Unfortunately after the film's release it turned out that most of the "survivors" in the film were liars. They were a small number of such liars who have made handsome livings out of fabricating tails of mass murders in the camps, consistent with the hoaxes of the Nuremberg trials.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=80GgRWuXc08

After these "witnesses" were discredited Speilberg wanted to get to the truth of what really happend, so he endowed USC with millions of dollars to track down and record on film the testimony of as many living camp survivors as could be found.

This project, the "Shoah Project of USC" has provided for the first time an accurate account of what life was like in the camps, told by thousands of camp survivors instead of the handful of liars who are otherwise the only ones heard.

According to 99% of these survivors there was no mass killings. There were however hospitals, football leagues, theaters, and at Auschwitz even a swimming pool. All of this is totally consistent with what the International Red Cross found on their many visits to the camps.

BTW the IRC also cooperated with the CIA and the Vatican to help German "war criminals" escape from Europe.

Just because the public continues to believe these myths doesn't mean there's any evidence.

The public also believes that Stalin died from a stroke when he didn't [he was murdered in a coup on March 23, 1953]

The public also believes that Hitler died in a bunker and his body burned [Hitler and Martin Boorman escaped to Argentina and lived there for years with CIA assistance].

While Hitler and Boorman were safely in Argentina having children and eating bratwurst Hitler's chief intelligence officer, Reinhard Gehlen, was set up with his entire apperatus by the CIA as West Germany's new Intelligence Service. Gehlen and his group remained in control of all West German Intelligence until their respective retirements.

You are a true Nazi Welcome to sanity.