Parliamentary maneuver or thwarting the will of the people?

[pjorourke]

If these folks would grow a pair, maybe the schools wouldn't be so fucked up.

I can't imagine a jury finding for little Johnny and his switchblade.

[gnadfly]

Originally Posted by CaptainMidnight

Perhaps I'm simply unaware of the extent to which bad kids sobotage our educational system in some urban school districts. When I was growing up in Dallas in the '50s and '60s, it wasn't too hard for schools to deal with punks. If a couple of warnings and relatively minor punishments didn't suffice, the specter of a transfer to what was then called "reform school" might do the trick.

They are called "Charter Schools" today. My ex-wife teaches at one. A co-worker whose wife is a teacher at a school district in north Houston complained that the charter school was hogging all the better students and the ISD his wife worked at had to take on whoever came thru the doors. Seriously. Not a "Magnet School" but a "Charter School."

There are so many agendas going on in the school systems today its politically incorrect to identify the real issues. In Texas, we have a school rating system. Look at where the "Exemplary" schools are located: mostly "light" (their term, not mine) more affluent neighborhoods. The amount of homework they send home to maintain this top ranking with the kids is crushing. I know first hand. The teachers want to teach at those schools because the students are better quality, they have the backing of the parents, there is adequate funding and the administrators don't have a survival mentality.

Go to a lower tier school. Many (not all) of the students don't have high scholastic achievement potential, their parent(s) don't give a damn and the teachers and admins are praying that somehow their schools standardized scores don't fall below a certain number.

Are the teachers at the higher tier school better than at the lower tier schools? Well, by the test scores, yes. Are they? Maybe, but I'd like to see how each set of teachers fared if they had to switch schools.

BTW, I grew up in Oak Cliff during the 60s/70s.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

They are called "Charter Schools" today. My ex-wife teaches at one. A co-worker whose wife is a teacher at a school district in north Houston complained that the charter school was hogging all the better students and the ISD his wife worked at had to take on whoever came thru the doors. Seriously. Not a "Magnet School" but a "Charter School."

There are so many agendas going on in the school systems today its politically incorrect to identify the real issues. In Texas, we have a school rating system. Look at where the "Exemplary" schools are located: mostly "light" (their term, not mine) more affluent neighborhoods. The amount of homework they send home to maintain this top ranking with the kids is crushing. I know first hand. The teachers want to teach at those schools because the students are better quality, they have the backing of the parents, there is adequate funding and the administrators don't have a survival mentality.

Go to a lower tier school. Many (not all) of the students don't have high scholastic achievement potential, their parent(s) don't give a damn and the teachers and admins are praying that somehow their schools standardized scores don't fall below a certain number.

Are the teachers at the higher tier school better than at the lower tier schools? Well, by the test scores, yes. Are they? Maybe, but I'd like to see how each set of teachers fared if they had to switch schools.

BTW, I grew up in Oak Cliff during the 60s/70s.

Good points Gnad!

I'm reading a book with an intresting POV on teaching, will send you a pm when I return from vacation.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

They are called "Charter Schools" today. My ex-wife teaches at one. A co-worker whose wife is a teacher at a school district in north Houston complained that the charter school was hogging all the better students and the ISD his wife worked at had to take on whoever came thru the doors. Seriously. Not a "Magnet School" but a "Charter School."

There are so many agendas going on in the school systems today its politically incorrect to identify the real issues. In Texas, we have a school rating system. Look at where the "Exemplary" schools are located: mostly "light" (their term, not mine) more affluent neighborhoods. The amount of homework they send home to maintain this top ranking with the kids is crushing. I know first hand. The teachers want to teach at those schools because the students are better quality, they have the backing of the parents, there is adequate funding and the administrators don't have a survival mentality.

Go to a lower tier school. Many (not all) of the students don't have high scholastic achievement potential, their parent(s) don't give a damn and the teachers and admins are praying that somehow their schools standardized scores don't fall below a certain number.

Are the teachers at the higher tier school better than at the lower tier schools? Well, by the test scores, yes. Are they? Maybe, but I'd like to see how each set of teachers fared if they had to switch schools.

I fully agree that it’s wrong to suggest that a teacher working in an ISD is inferior to one working at a charter school. It’s my belief that teachers want to be successful wherever they are, and that the teaching profession has no more than its share of bad apples. I also suggest that it is unfair to suggest that charter schools are superior to and should replace public schools for the same reason. Sooner or later, society has to deal with those students charter schools currently reject. OTH, we can keep building prisons.

[pjorourke]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

The teachers want to teach at those schools because the students are better quality, they have the backing of the parents, there is adequate funding and the administrators don't have a survival mentality.

In a rational world, these teachers would be paid LESS than the teachers at the hard-core schools. Enough less that really good/capable teachers would be attracted to these higher paying schools.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

BTW, I grew up in Oak Cliff during the 60s/70s.

I was not there in the 60s/70s, but I sure liked working there in the 90s. The only bad thing...when I commuted after dark, I was just a tad scared. Nothing ever happened, but the "thrill" was always there.

[TexTushHog]

Originally Posted by nevergaveitathought

lawsuits and lawyer twisting of facts and discrimination and racism charges have contributed to the one size fits all mentality

Bullshit. Educators have more legal protections than one can imagine. I can't think of a harder group to successfully sue.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Bullshit. Educators have more legal protections than one can imagine. I can't think of a harder group to successfully sue.

Sued is sued. Whether successful or not it still creates an atmosphere of fear and anxiety, and that leads to CYOA decision making at all levels.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Bullshit. Educators have more legal protections than one can imagine. I can't think of a harder group to successfully sue.

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Sued is sued. Whether successful or not it still creates an atmosphere of fear and anxiety, and that leads to CYOA decision making at all levels.

Yeah, special laws protect teachers & school districts. And the districts owe teachers the duty to defend them, or provide a defense for them. Sued is sued, yes. But the cost of the defense falls squarely on the insurance carrier or the district.