Is Speech Suppressed on the ECCIE Boards???

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Chevalier

Your approach is certainly more efficient, and may be better at getting their attention. And I'm sure it's more enjoyable for you.

You are assuming quite a bit there my friend. How do you know that it is enjoyable for her. Don't you think she would prefer honest discourse? That takes effort from all parties. So maybe her approach is different from yours but how boring would that be if we all thought alike?

Originally Posted by Chevalier

Do you find that it also is more effective, in terms of persuading them to change their behavior? Because that was my point. My observations over a course of many years is that "blunt" turns into "harsh" turns into "nasty" -- and the target reciprocates in kind, escalating the anger.

Don't you find it a bit ironic that your approach seems not to be changing any/all minds. Is that your objective? Or are you posting for the enjoyment of it?

Originally Posted by Chevalier

If the goal is to feel good and inflict pain on the target, the approach you describe may be effective. If the goal is to improve the "environment" by driving the target away permanently, it may also be effective, at a short term cost to other members who dislike drama. But it may not be effective; often, those people are just spoiling for a fight themselves. And if the goal is to improve the "environment" not by driving the target away but by persuading the target to change their behavior, the approach you describe seems very unlikely to be effective. Or, as someone else once put it:



So, what is your goal?

Let's turn this buggy around.

What is your goal?

Do you want everyone to debate like you?

If not , do you want to make people feel inferior if they do not accept your premise?

I have found through the years that people are more tolerant of folks they like than those they do not. When you get folks going at each other that do not care for each other , no amount of debating etiquette is suffice.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

IDK, just asking the question.

Originally Posted by London Rayne

In a word..yes! For certain people it is. Usually, those who don't agree with the majority are the ones who can't have a voice.

Originally Posted by John Bull

Nonsense! As long as you treat others with respect and civility, you may say anything you like in D&T as long as it conforms to general Eccie rules.

After all, PJ, WTF and Charles have been doing it for years and years and years...

JB, I notice you didn't include atl in that list.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

JB, I notice you didn't include atl in that list.

He is just getting up in years charles....you're on that list, trust me!

[pjorourke]

Yeah, WTF is right. JB is not playing with a full deck.

[Chevalier]

WTF,

Actually I had no intent to engage Nina in debate. I entered the thread to agree with a comment by Mazo to the effect that (feel free to correct if I misinterpreted)

1) The owners, through their representatives, have suggested that more decorum and civility would be nice
2) The mods can't do it alone
3) It takes a village -- hey, the community can help accomplish that!
4) Here's how I suggest we do that

So I posted to endorse his suggestion, particularly a word he chose to emphasize. And Nina posted to take exception to my comment.

Since then, my goal has been to engage with her in hopes of clarifying and understanding her position and perhaps even persuading her to change it. I haven't and probably won't, in part because language is slippery and we may not be using it the same way. For example, where I come from, there's nothing intrinsically wrong with persuading people to change their behavior, and it isn't necessarily something that deserves a pejorative like "manipulative". Most of us do it all the time. Heck, I would characterize Nina as trying to change people's behavior so they would back up their statements rather than engage in drive-by one-liners. (Just a paraphrase and I haven't read her posts closely enough to state it precisely). In fact, I suspect you may be trying to change my behavior and STFU. (Soon, soon. ) But Nina apparently doesn't mean the same thing by "change people's behavior" as I do. And there are probably other differences as well, as a result of which we're talking past each other and neither really understanding the other. A shame, but there you have it.

In any event, I don't hang out here often, don't know the players or the cliques, am not myself a member of any clique, and as a result may not catch all the subtle clues you natives pick up on. I'm surely an outsider here. If you were hinting (I have no idea and am not saying you did, just posing a hypothetical) that my personality and/or style of posting are such that me or my posts annoy most people here . . . why, bless your little heart, you'd probably be right.

But it's late and I have other things to do, so I'll say good night. Have fun playing, y'all, and maybe I'll drop by again next week.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Chevalier

WTF,

Actually I had no intent to engage Nina in debate.

you didn`t???

Heck, I would characterize Nina as trying to change people's behavior so they would back up their statements rather than engage in drive-by one-liners. (Just a paraphrase and I haven't read her posts closely enough to state it precisely).

No, you are again wrong. They can write one-line statements all they want, BUT i deserve the right to comment on that AND demand clarification or stuff like that. Problem i have is when people call mods for my demand of clarification. That is unfair. And the point was - when and if mods should interact -( But i dont see that happen here anymore. So everyone is capable of learning.) Of course i have my personal wish list on which people i like to energetically interact with - but i try not to change people`s behaviour. I just voice my opinion on that. Thats everybody`s right. And different than you trying to sweettalk people into doing what you do.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Chevalier

WTF,

Actually I had no intent to engage Nina in debate. I entered the thread to agree with a comment by Mazo to the effect that (feel free to correct if I misinterpreted)

1) The owners, through their representatives, have suggested that more decorum and civility would be nice
2) The mods can't do it alone
3) It takes a village -- hey, the community can help accomplish that!
4) Here's how I suggest we do that

.

I have no ideal if the owners asked the Mod to make this post. I kinda doubt it but who knows. You are good at planting seeds though.

Originally Posted by Chevalier

In fact, I suspect you may be trying to change my behavior and STFU..

No, no you can talk away. I am not one to ever want to limit what one might say. I either choose to engage you or not.

Originally Posted by Chevalier

In any event, I don't hang out here often, don't know the players or the cliques, am not myself a member of any clique, and as a result may not catch all the subtle clues you natives pick up on. I'm surely an outsider here. If you were hinting (I have no idea and am not saying you did, just posing a hypothetical) that my personality and/or style of posting are such that me or my posts annoy most people here . . . why, bless your little heart, you'd probably be right.

.

Don't sell yourself short there Chevy....you can talk chit with the best of'em and high brow it all the while you are doing it. That is a talent I'd admire! Welcome aboard.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by Chevalier

3) It takes a village

[**Turning to see PJ, RK, IAL, DFW5, Marshall (HFCjr), and JB cringing at the phrase. **]

[pjorourke]

Hillary did kind of fuck up a good term.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Originally Posted by Chevalier

1) The owners, through their representatives, have suggested that more decorum and civility would be nice

Nope. However no rocket science needed here.