Think Before You Vote!

[matchingmole]

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by ICU 812

Earlier in this thread I stated my opinion that voting for (or against) either of the presidential candidates is folly. Both men are seriously compromised in any measure of character; integrity, ethics etc. I further make the pint that the Democratic party of 2020 is very different from the Democratic party of the past, say from President Roosevelt forward, perhaps through Clinton, then described some of what I perceive as the differences. I Am convinced that the changes enumerated are all negative.

Opposing my OP and my subsequent support for that OP, have come posts that indulge in middle-school level name calling and personal slander; that's OK, I am a big boy.

What I do not see here is much if any actual refutation of my position on the Democratic party of 2020. None of the named Democrats of 20th Century would endorse any of the policies or practices of the Democratic party in the 21st.

Government really has just a few responsibilities; preserving the nation from outside aggression, ensuring public safety and at the local level, removing garbage to name a few. I recommend reading the Preamble to The Constitution. Releasing jailed criminals and passively allowing riot and looting are not among them.

Drop the name calling and refute something with well reasoned discussion.

Well, yeah, I kind of agree. As you say, Trump is compromised in terms of character, integrity and ethics. And Biden is dead set on fucking my friends, the people I work with, and, most importantly, me. Actually, economically, I think Biden's policies will be bad for most people if pursued over the long term.

So I took your suggestion and didn't vote for either one of them. Jo Jorgensen's policies overlap best with what I like, although I realize since I voted for her my vote didn't make a difference. Of course, if I'd voted for Trump or Biden my vote wouldn't have made a difference either, as there's a snowball's chance in hell the next president will be decided by one vote in Texas.

So better to send the bastards a message -- as you say, they both suck.

[matchingmole]

they both suck

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by Tiny

...So I took your suggestion and didn't vote for either one of them. ...

One vote saved his bacon. Believe Rutherford B Hayes would extol the virtues of one vote as well.

[ICU 812]

Originally Posted by Tiny

So I took your suggestion and didn't vote for either one of them. Jo Jorgensen's policies overlap best with what I like, although I realize since I voted for her my vote didn't make a difference. Of course, if I'd voted for Trump or Biden my vote wouldn't have made a difference either, as there's a snowball's chance in hell the next president will be decided by one vote in Texas.

So better to send the bastards a message -- as you say, they both suck.

Tiny: With full respect for you and your choice I say . .

.I think that you missed my point entirely. I was trying to encourage voters to cast their ballots based not on the relative merits of Biden or Trump, as neither one is a man I would hold up as a role model of manhood to my grand son. Rather, I was suggesting that a voter look at what the Democrats seem to stand for this time around.

In my view, bone of the Democratic presidents since 1932 would have endorsed any part of the party platform this year. I think the activities of Antifa and Black Lives Matter would also have been opposed by most Democratic politicians from President Roosevelt up through President Clinton. The support for the anarchist chaos given by state and local Democratic officials, passive and active, would never be endorsed or encouraged by any Democrat prior to Clinton either.

My point is, do not vote for or against either man, but instead make your choices based on the overall actions or inactions of the Democratic Party overall.

[1blackman1]

The Republicans are worse. Vote them out.

[Yssup Rider]

Every fucking one of them. They are all enablers in the destruction of this country.

I will take no pleasure listening to the Proud Boys of ECCIE rage and cry the next twelve years, but gladly assume that mantle for the good of the nation.

If you haven’t voted yet, don’t blow it. Vote tomorrow.

If you have, good for you.

If you still don’t whom to vote for, are you kidding me?

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by ICU 812

My point is, do not vote for or against either man, but instead make your choices based on the overall actions or inactions of the Democratic Party overall.

Sorry but I would add in that voters should look at Trump's record while he has been in office and determine for themselves whether or not 4 more years with him in office is in the best interests of the country. If the answer is yes, vote for him. If the answer is no, vote for one of the others on the ballot.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by ICU 812

Tiny: With full respect for you and your choice I say . .

.I think that you missed my point entirely. I was trying to encourage voters to cast their ballots based not on the relative merits of Biden or Trump, as neither one is a man I would hold up as a role model of manhood to my grand son. Rather, I was suggesting that a voter look at what the Democrats seem to stand for this time around.

In my view, bone of the Democratic presidents since 1932 would have endorsed any part of the party platform this year. I think the activities of Antifa and Black Lives Matter would also have been opposed by most Democratic politicians from President Roosevelt up through President Clinton. The support for the anarchist chaos given by state and local Democratic officials, passive and active, would never be endorsed or encouraged by any Democrat prior to Clinton either.

My point is, do not vote for or against either man, but instead make your choices based on the overall actions or inactions of the Democratic Party overall.

ICU, I actually didn't misunderstand, and have replied to your point in other threads. I was being a little sarcastic, sorry for that.

Replying to the above and your OP, I disagree with some of your statements. Jimmy Carter is and George McGovern would be very comfortable with Joe Biden as president. People like Angela Davis, Stokley Carmichael, H. Rap Brown, Bobby Seal, and Abby Hoffman have not taken over the Democratic Party. I'm not at all worried about anarchy or marauding hoards if Democrats win. That said, I do not live in Houston like you. My locality is run by Republicans politicians. I do think the Republican Party does a better job of running things at the local and state level. It's the party of businessmen. The Democratic Party is the party of the Plaintiff's lawyers, who are good at suing people and not much else.

My main concern though is economics. I hinted at this in a couple of replies to SpeedRacer earlier in this thread, that no one probably read because they were technical. But Biden and Democratic Congressmen and women want to increase the size of government. They want the USA to be like, say, France. Government spending as a % of GDP in the USA is 35%, compared to 55% in France. And largely as a result, GDP per capita in France is 28% lower than the USA. I don't want us to go there, that is, to become poorer.

I don't think Biden would take us all the way there, certainly not in 4 years. His proposals according to independent analysts would increase government spending by about 4% or 5% of GDP. But Kamala Harris and the up and coming Democrats like Warren and AOC would take us there and further. I do not believe their policies would result in the USA becoming another Venezuela. But Argentina would be a strong possibility.