I can't believe this hasn't been discussed yet

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Do all you anti-Islamic wingnuts want to take the mosque out of the Pentagon?

How about the houses of worship at our military academies? West Point? The Naval Academy? The Air Force Academy? I don't know about the others, but the "chapel" at the Air Force Academy is divided: the major upstairs is for Protestants, the major downstairs for Catholics. The minor downstairs area is for Buddhists, Muslims, and people of Jewish faith.

Query: does any of that violate the establishment clause since it is on federal government property?

[discreetgent]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

Query: does any of that violate the establishment clause since it is on federal government property?

No, because accommodation is being made for any religion; the government is not favoring one over the other.

[Rudyard K]

I'm still not sure whether I think this thing shold be as big of a deal as it is. Probably shouldn't.

But I do think it is interesting how all these folks ripping the people who don't want it there...fail to see the symbolism of ground zero to many people...and many who rip folks here, are the same who were disgusted with folks who would display the confederate flag.

It seems to follow in line with their world which seems to be...My thoughts, symbols, concepts?...Very important. Yours?...Well, not so much.

[Happy Diver]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

It seems to follow in line with their world which seems to be...My thoughts, symbols, concepts?...Very important. Yours?...Well, not so much.

Well said.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

It seems to follow in line with their world which seems to be...My thoughts, symbols, concepts?...Very important. Yours?...Well, not so much.

Yea but that comes from those on both sides of the aisle. It is at the end of the day why there should be a discussion on things like this. The problem is that the folks on the far end of each side of the discussion, who make the most noise and profit the most from divisiveness, will never listen to reason.

But you were right when you said earlier that people protest things being built all the time. My neighbors are up in arms over a proposed Wal-Mart being built close by. They are not anti Wal-Mart, they are anti-traffic.

Now these folks protesting seem anti-Muslim and to me that is the discussion that we should be having along with this blind nationalistic stance that has some folks deaf and dumb by taking this moderate Muslim words out of context.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by Rudyard K

It seems to follow in line with their world which seems to be...My thoughts, symbols, concepts?...Very important. Yours?...Well, not so much.

Originally Posted by Happy Diver

Well said.

+1

[AvaAstor]

Let me clarify something. There is no mosque at the Pentagon. There is a room that is designed for muslims use - for daily prayer. It is not a mosque. It is like having a chapel in a hospital.....

[John Bull]

Originally Posted by AvaAstor

Let me clarify something. There is no mosque at the Pentagon. There is a room that is designed for muslims use - for daily prayer. It is not a mosque. It is like having a chapel in a hospital.....

It is actually a chapel that is convertible to any of the major religions and each has services in this same chapel.

As a point of interest, the chapel is very close to or actually is in the area where the airliner hit the Pentagon and killed over 120 people.

[gnadfly]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Do all you anti-Islamic wingnuts want to take the mosque out of the Pentagon? There has been one there for years. And the Pentagon was a target on 9/11. If all the Muslims are as evil and violent and dedicated to our over throw as you claim, shouldn't we throw their ass out of the Pentagon, too?

And I'm curious. It defames ground zero to have a mosque two blocks away, but not to have a department store across the street? A McDonald's and a Starbucks around the corner?

And how big a "Muslim free zone" is a country with no official religion that guarantees both it's citizens and visitors of other nations "free exercise of religion" supposed to be? Two square blocks? Three? One square mile? All of Manhattan? All of D.C.? In how large an area do we discriminate against these guys?

Do all you liberal useful idiots want the mosque out of the Pentagon? Or do wish that the Pentagon was totally destroyed like the Twin Towers save the mosque?

I wouldn't call it discrimination with what is happening to the 'Victory Mosque.' There is no 'Muslim Free Zone.' Your 'How far' argument is an just a sorry distraction. Gawd I hope your pleadings in court are better than your written arguments.

Newsflash: a dept store didn't hijack a plane and kill 3000 people.

[Guest050715-1]

I think that if this were purely about religion, then the placement of the mosque and community center would be anywhere but at Ground Zero. Therefore, I think the motive is political. Someone made the point that this building was purchased for significantly under its value. The money the bought the building and the money that will build the project is so very vast that literally money doesn’t matter. This isn’t about religion, and this isn’t about getting a great deal on 9/11 damaged property. It is political and that’s why I am opposed to it.

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Do all you anti-Islamic wingnuts want to take the mosque out of the Pentagon? There has been one there for years. And the Pentagon was a target on 9/11. If all the Muslims are as evil and violent and dedicated to our over throw as you claim, shouldn't we throw their ass out of the Pentagon, too?

And I'm curious. It defames ground zero to have a mosque two blocks away, but not to have a department store across the street? A McDonald's and a Starbucks around the corner?

And how big a "Muslim free zone" is a country with no official religion that guarantees both it's citizens and visitors of other nations "free exercise of religion" supposed to be? Two square blocks? Three? One square mile? All of Manhattan? All of D.C.? In how large an area do we discriminate against these guys?

TTH, Charles brought this up earlier. If people think it’s too close to GZ, then it probably is. If this were about religion and culture and not politics, common decency would let you know when you are far enough away from the burial site of thousands of our fellows.

Actually, capitalism encroaching on ground zero was addressed by Charles too. It has nothing whatsoever to do with foreign politicos coming in and placing their cultural embassy at the site of a mass murder in the name of their God. Throwing in capitalism and merchants at GZ is just something throw the hounds off the scent. It has nothing to do with religious rights or foreign politics.

I do not hold at all with any of the fodder that Islam is a violent religion. It isn’t. But I do think that for the leaders and wealthy foreign nationals of Islam are just as political as the Pope was in pre-modern era Europe. The two are different sides of the same coin. Or worse, they are a two headed monster.

The existing mosque near GZ or the "chapel" at the Pentagon, I can only assume, were built as houses of worship and there their mission was that of religion for the congregation. Placing one at either site now, after the attacks, next door to a sacred burial ground is about POLITICS. Again, this is just another red herring to throw off the dogs. When emotions run high, throw more gasoline on the fire; it is a very common and successful tactic.

[pyramider]

Just put a pig rendering plant next to the mosque.

[Guest083011]

Bloomberg opined today that there are "porn shops" and other estabilishments near GZ. I had to chuckle at the porn shops. Say Mike, could I get those addys? Betcha there's a courtesan or two in that neck of the woods too. As someone said outside of eccie, put a gay bar on one side and Hooters on the other side of the proposed Mosque.

[TexTushHog]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Newsflash: a dept store didn't hijack a plane and kill 3000 people.

Newsflash: Neither the the Muslim religion. Just a bunch of fucking Suadi nuts who were Muslims.

Are we going to ban Christian churches in town where the KKK -- a Christian organization, just ask them -- burns crosses?

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

It has nothing whatsoever to do with foreign politicos coming in and placing their cultural embassy at the site of a mass murder in the name of their God.

You may not have noticed, but "their God" is the same God as y'all's Christian God.

Islam is the third of thethree great Abrahamic monotheistic religions and has the very same God as Christianity and Judaism. Abraham's son Ismail is considered a forerunner of Mohammad. The Hajj, Islam's traditional pilgrimage to Mecca, is in fact a commiseration of God's trial of Abraham by commanding him to sacrifice Ismail. And Abraham is also the only other Prophet of God other than Mohammad that is mention in the five times a day daily prayers of Muslims.

[Doove]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Newsflash: Neither the the Muslim religion. Just a bunch of fucking Suadi nuts who were Muslims.

Are we going to ban Christian churches in town where the KKK -- a Christian organization, just ask them -- burns crosses?

You may not have noticed, but "their God" is the same God as y'all's Christian God.

Just another one of them Conservative outrages, where they work themselves all up into a lather screaming to anyone who will listen about how horrible something is, that ain't. If/when this thing gets built, 2 weeks after it's opened, nobody will give a flying f*ck anymore.

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by Doove

Just another one of them Conservative outrages, where they work themselves all up into a lather screaming to anyone who will listen about how horrible something is, that ain't. If/when this thing gets built, 2 weeks after it's opened, nobody will give a flying f*ck anymore.

+1

That is an accurate description of how I feel about it right now!