Afghan massacre

[Missy Mariposa]

But, I can't help but be amazed at the reaction by the Afghans. Demonstrating and raising all sorts of hell. Where is all the outrage when their fellow countrymen stroll into a market or a church and detonate a suicide bomb vest, killing dozens of women and children?

Playing devils advocate for a minute:

Domestic terrorism is a whole different ballgame than someone from another country (especially someone who happens to be in the military that has been occupying your country for about 10 years) coming in and doing something. Especially when that country touts itself on not being terrorist and being in a war against terror and all that other stuff we spew in the media. We put ourselves on a pedestal and unfortunately when someone snap, this is the fallout.

What it comes down to is people are people are people. Doesn't matter where they're from, what colour they are, or any of it. They should be judged on their ACT, not any of the other stuff. But that's not the world we live in.


That being said, I just find the entire situation sad. I know our soldiers go through a ton of shit, especially over there, and I feel nothing but heartbreak and sympathy for them. I feel sympathy for the victims in this case as well.

[cptjohnstone]

Lordy Lordy put a sticky on this thread

EVERYBODY IS IN AGREEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!

oh wait, fartman has not posted

[gnadfly]

My understanding is the guy has done 3 tours. He also suffered a head trauma and passed a eval to put him back into the field.

[misc.adventure]

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/20...-death-penalty

"....He is a 38-year-old married father of two on his first deployment to Afghanistan after three previous deployments in Iraq..."

[WTF]

Originally Posted by cptjohnstone

Lordy Lordy put a sticky on this thread

EVERYBODY IS IN AGREEMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!

oh wait, fartman has not posted

Originally Posted by gnadfly

My understanding is the guy has done 3 tours. He also suffered a head trauma and passed a eval to put him back into the field.

Gnadfly has not weighed in on whether we should get the fuc out.

What do you think about us leaving both Iraq and Afghanistan.

Gnadfly is a pure policy wonk.

Educate us oh brainy one...

[DEPmic05]

Saw too many combat stress cases when I was over there. Also know Service Members that have returned with noticeable changes in their personality. Nightmares, irritability, frustration, anger are all common for anyone that suffered a head injury. And every Service Member ever caught in an IED blast suffered head injuries. Some even got hit numerous times by IED blasts over their tour(s).

The Afghans...they don't expect us to stay. They never expect anyone to stay. Any new army that comes into their country, the afghans try to suck as much as they can out of them until they leave. That was the attitude you saw over there.

Stimulating the local economy by hiring locals to do work on bases? All that happens when you do that is that some Afghan businessman based in Kabul is awarded the contract, then sub-contracts down to other Afghans, paying them next to nothing to do the work. Meanwhile, the Afghan contractor keeps all the money he can and invests it into a home in Turkey, India, Saudi Arabia, even Europe. They get their families set up and when the US finally pulls out, they take off with all the money (the money that was intended to go into the local economy) and leave Afghanistan behind. I hated dealing with those contractors (you could identify them easily...pure white man-jammies, red dyed beard, very big mid-sections from good living).

There are some Afghans genuinely interested in changing things. They'll be killed when we leave. If their not quick enough to flee the country themselves when we get ready to pull out.

[gnadfly]

Originally Posted by WTF

Gnadfly has not weighed in on whether we should get the fuc out.

What do you think about us leaving both Iraq and Afghanistan.

Gnadfly is a pure policy wonk.

Educate us oh brainy one...

Your intellectual insecurity is justified. I'll let you enlarge the scope of the thread to whatever you see fit...not that anyone can stop you.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Your intellectual insecurity is justified. I'll let you enlarge the scope of the thread to whatever you see fit...not that anyone can stop you.

Enlighten us with your thoughts on the matter.

You never have defered to me in the past, don't start now.

[JD Barleycorn]

Is it the consensus of the people here that we just leave "TROOPS! We are leaving!" or do we try to do something for the people who have been helping us?

When they decided not to win this war it was time to come home immediately. Never fight a war you can't win or don't want to win.

I do not like hearing the term "mercenary" when describing a US servicemen. They volunteered and many would join even without the inducements. Mercenaries by their nature fight primarily for money and not a cause or country.

No comment yet from our resident Afghan vet who returned about six months ago.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

Is it the consensus of the people here that we just leave "TROOPS! We are leaving!" or do we try to do something for the people who have been helping us?

When they decided not to win this war it was time to come home immediately. Never fight a war you can't win or don't want to win.

I do not like hearing the term "mercenary" when describing a US servicemen. They volunteered and many would join even without the inducements. Mercenaries by their nature fight primarily for money and not a cause or country.

No comment yet from our resident Afghan vet who returned about six months ago.

What do you think we should do JD?

And yes, I too am curious as to what IB views are on this subject.

Originally Posted by JD Barleycorn

When they decided not to win this war it was time to come home immediately. Never fight a war you can't win or don't want to win.

.

Is this your way of blaming it on the present admin?

[JD Barleycorn]

I guess I shouldn't be disappointed that WTF is still trying to pick a fight even when we all agree in principal.

It is past time to leave Afghanistan but I think (you asked) that the US has to make a real good faith effort to either protect or take with us any Afghans who put their lives (and this includes their families in this tribal society) on the line to help us.

Do I blame this current administration? Is this the administration that said that Afghanistan was the good war? Is this the administration that decided that the war was not going to be or could not be won? Ever hear of this quote from a famous democrat, "The Buck Stops Here"? If you want a fight so bad WTF why don't you go and take your own tour of Afghanistan otherwise go piss up a rope.

[Little Stevie]

No matter how you would like to phrase it, the righties have gone from "supporting the troops" to "cutting and running".

I hear them using the same phrases they laughed at the other side for using under Bush.

It DOES prove one thing. They are far slower learners than liberals.

Oh, and Cheney's prediction that the Iraq War would fund itself with oil was just another lie.

[Laz]

Unless we want to take over Afghanistan, which I don't think anyone would support, we need to pull out. We are there to nation build at this point and that only works if you have the support of the government and the governed. That is clearly not the case. I would like to think Bush and Obama acted in good faith in an effort to do what was right. If there was significant public support in Afghanistan we would be having a much better conversation but since that is not the case it is time to quit wasting money and the lives of good men and women on a bunch of people that have no interest in our help.

When we pull out it will be a mess again and the Taliban might take over again but they have made their choice so let them live with it. If they go back to supporting terrorism we can deal with that in a way that discourages them. I believe in targeted assassination of the leaders that make those decisions.

[i'va biggen]

I heard it was a whore house and one of the women had given him the clap.

[IIFFOFRDB]

When it comes to our Soldiers. We all agree. They are the best. Thanks Tim. Your avatar sure has a nice ASS.